Idle oddness

[clivvy]

thanks for explaining this Ray, probably a good job i couldnt adjust it then!

i did give the little micros switch a good wipe (carefully) and what you say makes sense but still not sure thats it.its really hard to explain, but when it does this thing, at its worst, the whole car can wobble just the once, then it settles for a bit then might do it again, as if you are lightly tapping the accelerator pedal just a bit, try it, youll see what i mean....its infuriating!

when i get it back tonight, im going to take it for a long drive to see if it does it, then drive it this week again to see if it does it, if it does, its going to fEATHER dIESEL IN elland for diagnosis because im not going to be abel to figure it out. its a lot of money to pay for what most people would regard as minor, but i really NEED it right as i have to tow a caravan with it soon!!

 

[clivvy]

so this morning it happened, but more so. last night it rained. started car and it was doing it, very slight mind, put foot on break, and car in gear, and it did it more so, not enough to wobble the car or stall, and needle hardly moved, but it was there. took out of gear, less, took foot off break, less again. meh, i thought, drive to mc dongles for my egg muffin, then into work, didnt skip a beat.

but, what theb loody hell causes that?? im very much leaning towards jims theory of vacuum or load on the alternator...or, is it possible to be battery? then again, i can turn everything on and it makes no difference, only ever seems to be breaks/gears...??

 

[macabethiel]

idle oddness

I had a similar issue on a previous vehicle that was cured when I replaced an injector that was giving the idle a sort of hicup that was quite regular and seeme worse when hot.

The problem came back about three months later and I was all set to replace the other 5 injectors (expensive option as they were not cheap) when my local garage sold me some industry specific injector cleaner. Can't remeber the make but its one the trade buy from wholesalers cost me £12.00 5 years ago.

I was very sceptical so did as advised and mixed this 1 litre can into a one gallon can of fuel.

Waited until the car was very low on fuel. Put in the gallon of mixture and a couple of days later all was well. Remained so until I sold the vehicle a couple of years later with 187 k on the clock !

 

[briggie]

injector cleaner , or fuel system cleaner .... i think there is a difference

 

[clivvy]

I had a similar issue on a previous vehicle that was cured when I replaced an injector that was giving the idle a sort of hicup that was quite regular and seeme worse when hot.

The problem came back about three months later and I was all set to replace the other 5 injectors (expensive option as they were not cheap) when my local garage sold me some industry specific injector cleaner. Can't remeber the make but its one the trade buy from wholesalers cost me £12.00 5 years ago.

I was very sceptical so did as advised and mixed this 1 litre can into a one gallon can of fuel.

Waited until the car was very low on fuel. Put in the gallon of mixture and a couple of days later all was well. Remained so until I sold the vehicle a couple of years later with 187 k on the clock !

hmmm...i shall investigate! i am wondering about the injectors tbh. the fourth injector looks like its leaked before or is leaking, and they dont look new, so i wonder if its as simple as new injectors? i only need the other three, so if i can find some cheap ish i might try that?

 

[clivvy]

Well, I'm sat in the car now, and it's bloody doing it. Hasn't really done it for weeks but seems worse from this morning to now... imagine it idling away a little low, with regular blips or drops, this can be felt, as I sit here now, I can't decide if it's getting better as it gets warmer...

 

[elty001]

just a thought on your judderness(i like that word)
mine did it when i had got a small fuel leak on the steel fuel pipes where they had corroded.was very small and i didn't notice the leak but it was enough to pull air into the fuel system.have you pressed the top of the priming pump(engine not running)to see if it is nice and firm.if you can press it then there is air in the fuel line at some point.

 

[clivvy]

just a thought on your judderness(i like that word)
mine did it when i had got a small fuel leak on the steel fuel pipes where they had corroded.was very small and i didn't notice the leak but it was enough to pull air into the fuel system.have you pressed the top of the priming pump(engine not running)to see if it is nice and firm.if you can press it then there is air in the fuel line at some point.

the primer pump is firm. does this discount the fuel pipes, or do i need to check them? If so, where do i begin, because im not sure where the pipes are !

 

[elty001]

mine had corroded near the tank.very hard to see as they run between the tank and chassis at that point.if you start at the tank the pipes run down the right hand side of the chassis(from rear)come from the tank as 2 rubber hoses then change to steel and run along the chassis with the brake line and clutch damper.they are the 2 largest pipes.just look along them to see if they are badly corroded and look for any wet areas.prone to going just in front of the rear wheel arch area where the pipes go over the chassis.

 

[clivvy]

mine had corroded near the tank.very hard to see as they run between the tank and chassis at that point.if you start at the tank the pipes run down the right hand side of the chassis(from rear)come from the tank as 2 rubber hoses then change to steel and run along the chassis with the brake line and clutch damper.they are the 2 largest pipes.just look along them to see if they are badly corroded and look for any wet areas.prone to going just in front of the rear wheel arch area where the pipes go over the chassis.

perfect mate, ill have a look.

i have looked at these pipes before, but i didnt realise they were fuel pipes. i know there is brakes and clutch together, but there was surface rust etc and its been treated, so ill clean it all up and have a good look.

cheers!

 

[clivvy]

ok, had a study of the pipes. theres more pipes than i was expecting, so here are two pics. first one is the bunch of pipes going back towards the rear of the vehicle, clear surface corrosion on some..

this link shows the pipes just a bit after the rear wheel arch. The brown stuff is copper grease, but if you look, the larger rubber pipes have staining, as if damp or something.

im not 100% sure, but i believe the two, large rubber pipes are my fuel pipes, but i cant see a leak, and looking at the fuel tank where they meet and that too looks bones dry.

what do you guys think???

 

[elty001]

have you got rubber fuel lines all the way along the chassis?
if so then they have already been replaced but the steel ones have just been left in situ.

 

[clivvy]

have you got rubber fuel lines all the way along the chassis?
if so then they have already been replaced but the steel ones have just been left in situ.

yes, as far as I can see from the tank, all the way to the pump, so that rules that out at least!

damn. means i have to keep searching for an answer!

one thing i DO need to do however, is remove the egr valve to open it up...

 

[jims-terrano]

Flippin heck mines doing it now!!!!!! Air Con has given up on me this last week or so so engine is just running and no AC kicking in and out changing the revs. There it is tonight I've been out in it and mine does the same as Clivvy's. Does this mean they are all prone to this? and it should be ignored? better get my AC sorted quick then I wont be able to tell if it's doing it:thumbs

Jim

 

[clivvy]

Flippin heck mines doing it now!!!!!! Air Con has given up on me this last week or so so engine is just running and no AC kicking in and out changing the revs. There it is tonight I've been out in it and mine does the same as Clivvy's. Does this mean they are all prone to this? and it should be ignored? better get my AC sorted quick then I wont be able to tell if it's doing it:thumbs

Jim

hey Jim, if you get time this weekend, lets compare, because if yours is the same as mine, then it will be good to kill two birds with one stone. Mine didnt do it at all this morning (cold/damp), but it DID do it yesterday...its random. in fact, the other day i thought i had found the issue at a petrol station, was waiting for heidi, and turned the fan off, the idle thing stopped. turned fan on, started. off, stopped, on started....anyway, that was a red herring because now it doesnt do it fan on or off :doh

 

[elty001]

maybe ive found the cure:nenau
usually fill up at local texaco garage but i filled up at a shell one today as i had to take the mrs to hospital and it was on the way.was very low on fuel so its had a tank full and it seems to have lost the juddering on idle:clap
could it be that texaco fuel is just crap:nenauand its a few pence dearer than the shell one.
will keep an eye on things and let you know what its like when ive put some miles on over the next week.going camping in the lincolnshire wolds next week so will see how it runs fully loaded with the trailer on.

 

[clivvy]

Nah, can't be that. I've tried fuel from every where, and it's the same. Sat in the car now, and it's doing it. Needle visibly bouncing, car shaking, gear stick moving, then steadies, then again randomly. Very weird. It kind of almost feels like it might stall, in terms of the vibration, but the needle doesn't dip, it only rises a bit. Arrrggghh, doing my head in. Pete has advised me to call Rick, so I will do that when I can and hopefully he won't mind. I don't want to go to a garage because that will only lead to me paying them to diagnose from scratch....

 

[clivvy]

ok, so after my little flap earlier, i decided to open the bonnet and get my screw driver out before i hit the road on a job at our other office. i decided it was time to check and tighten the various clips. most were ok. the little clip that attatches to a pipe above the oil filter at the top of the engine bay-liek a cylinder thing and a green sticker on top-round, tightened that up. checked the two fuel filter pipes, at the fuel filter end they were tight, but where the rubber pipes attach to the metal ones...they were both loose.....would that be causing any issues? I had to tighten them up.

a couple of others here and there but nothing major, just need to wait and see now....:nenau

 

[roythecoy]

hi i have just bought a 1997 2.7 tdi terrano 11 which has similar symptons to those mentioned. from cold the tickover hunts from normal down and up in revs until eventually it dies. It is better when warm in fact when i drove it home from buying it it was running ok after 30 miles but now back to being bad. When it dies it cannot be restarted until the ignition is turned off and a click of relay is heard, then the immobiliser lights flashes if the key is turned then it will start fine but run rough as described. Yes the volts from the alt go up and down but that i would expect as the alt is go faster and slower.I have run fuel directly to The injector pump syphoned from a can bypassing all piping and filters. When the engine is off but ign on, a whirring and clicking can be heard from the inj pump. Ive checked several sensors, i have mil light on dash, a code 18 recurring on the ecu. The pump is electonically controlled. Is the pump knackered, does anyone have an idea.

 

[clivvy]

hi i have just bought a 1997 2.7 tdi terrano 11 which has similar symptons to those mentioned. from cold the tickover hunts from normal down and up in revs until eventually it dies. It is better when warm in fact when i drove it home from buying it it was running ok after 30 miles but now back to being bad. When it dies it cannot be restarted until the ignition is turned off and a click of relay is heard, then the immobiliser lights flashes if the key is turned then it will start fine but run rough as described. Yes the volts from the alt go up and down but that i would expect as the alt is go faster and slower.I have run fuel directly to The injector pump syphoned from a can bypassing all piping and filters. When the engine is off but ign on, a whirring and clicking can be heard from the inj pump. Ive checked several sensors, i have mil light on dash, a code 18 recurring on the ecu. The pump is electonically controlled. Is the pump knackered, does anyone have an idea.

not sure about the pump, mine does something similar (the noise) but i believe thats normal. yours does sound like a fuelling issue if revs are hunting then eventually stalling, but its hard to tell with regards the injection pump. I get code 18 on and off, which is the fuel quantity adjuster sensor-part of the injection pump i believe so not replacable.. personally, id first clear the codes, and check the CKP sensor and No1 injector.