All Glass and non Glass members

[lacroupade]

Anyone here want to join in?

As soon as I have the dates I'll let you all know.

Please.

 

[extreme-4x4]

yes that the good thing to do all this stone and man power
ill come... but tell me one thing. who fixed the sarn up. who built the bridge for the walkers and bikes

they did all that then it got closed for good
for the last 3 weeks they have put a cycle route through our village for all these invisible bikes... ive never seen 1 bike use that part of the sarn

so who got stung ? who got sold a dream then got conned ?

the reason the lanes are being closed, is there are too many associations and all doing it their way too many john's

there has been no vote or poll to see whos idea is best. and people like me sit back and see the lanes getting closed while you say your saving them and giving up your time to fix them before they get closed.

why join its already lost. unless john can pull all groups together and pull in the outsiders into 1 solid plan of action . and work together as one

but thats not happening

united we stand divided we fall








oh and its not my secret club , actually wendy asked for me to re open it...
and she dont take sides, she just wanted some laddish fun and banter and thought it might be too offensive for some of the other members
funny videos and stuff

 

[nejones]

Another circle.

Never said it was a secret group.
I said it was a private group. Thats right isn't it? PM you and then you'll invite members you want to join?

If I pm you can I be part of your private group?
Wont hold my breath:augie

And is SARN closed permanently?

Isn't the fact that CRAG repaired/ replaced the lane/bridge with funding from local authority evidence that the lane can be driven under the terms of CROW/NERC?

 

[extreme-4x4]

Have you tried to contact this person Extreme ? most sites have a contact us section:augie

email sent to john already

ok john is the one trying to sort this out or fix the problem now

but what is needed is nationwide set of plans with all associations working together and bringing the outsides into the equation to have a good chance of making a stand

a demonstration don't work in small easily squashed pockets. 1 big united group is much harder to defeat .


after all we all want the same thing at the end of the day. freedom to use the lanes and tracks responsibly

 

[Terranosaurus]

Not at all up on Sarn Helen so I quickly consulted the GLASS forum.

Just confirmed and double checked with NPT council that all is well to drive the lower BOAT section from Aberdulais to Banwen this year, and the TRO is lifted as usual between June 1st and August 31st 2009.

I dont know if the following has been on the forum before, I got it of another club website

This is probably one of the longest routes that used to be available to us. When combined with the BOAT from Neath you could drive from the Brecon Beacons Visitors centre almost to the coast only touching on a couple of miles of tarmac. I have done it a couple of times and it was a GREAT day out.

The problem is that since NERC it has effectively been closed to us but there is hope to get it back BUT YOUR HELP IS NEEDED.

There has just been set up a Mid Wales Off Roading Forum which is chaired by the Dyfed Powys Police Inspector responsible for the area and attended by CRAG, GLASS, BBNPA, CCW, Powys County Council, Ceredigion County Council, TRF – possibly LARA, Elan Valley Trust, FCW etc.


The next meeting is in June and user evidence is needed. It will take you 10-15 minutes to fill in the form (link below) and then the price of a stamp to send it off.


The police are favouring our viewpoint at the moment having recinded several S59s despite BBNP saying there is no MPV rights

http://www.4shared.com/file/97200313/448ed879/Sarn_H

Post to
Mark,
Llanerchindda Farm
Cynghordy
Llandovery
Carmarthenshire
Wales,
and SA20
SA20 0NB

So it appears some of it may have been lost under NERC but that is being fought and the police at least at the moment are tending to agree that perhaps vehicular rights weren't extinguished under NERC.

And some of it has a seasonal TRO so that it is only driven during summer months when, British weather permitting, it should e in its best and most sustainable condition.

 

[Terranosaurus]

but what is needed is nationwide set of plans with all associations working together and bringing the outsides into the equation to have a good chance of making a stand

a demonstration don't work in small easily squashed pockets. 1 big united group is much harder to defeat .

We have a big umbrella group called LARA which also includes

Amateur Motor Cycle Association

Association of Land Rover Clubs

Auto-Cycle Union

British Motorcyclists Federation

Green Lane Association

Motor Cycle Industry Association Ltd.

Motor Sports Association Ltd.

The Trail Riders Fellowship


Between them they represent hundreds of thousands of people.

 

[Terranosaurus]

From LARAs website FYI

LARA's High Court action against the Yorkshire Dales National Park Authority is now in the 'warned list' for hearings, and so should be heard by the High Court quite soon. We still need Fighting Fund donations for this important case.
LARA challenge the TRO-making process in a National Park.

Read more about this - click here

 

[extreme-4x4]

Not at all up on Sarn Helen so I quickly consulted the GLASS forum.




So it appears some of it may have been lost under NERC but that is being fought and the police at least at the moment are tending to agree that perhaps vehicular rights weren't extinguished under NERC.

And some of it has a seasonal TRO so that it is only driven during summer months when, British weather permitting, it should e in its best and most sustainable condition.

so is that saying from brecon to banwen is closed under nerc..... oh well guess where the nice little bridge is then ?

so banwen to aberdulais is open in summer.... trouble is thats owned by walters and some shit arsed farmer who has blocked it. and nptc is favoring walters request to close it. due to off roaders entering his property health and safety..... so thats going be assured of that walters is mr wales he owns most of it. and councils love him

so from a 20 mile lane there is 4-5 miles open in summer and closing soon for good and the bit so kindly fixed up already gone 15 miles of it

 

[nejones]

so is that saying from brecon to banwen is closed under nerc..... oh well guess where the nice little bridge is then ?

so banwen to aberdulais is open in summer.... trouble is thats owned by walters and some shit arsed farmer who has blocked it. and nptc is favoring walters request to close it. due to off roaders entering his property health and safety..... so thats going be assured of that walters is mr wales he owns most of it. and councils love him

Read and try to comprehend all the posts on this subject please Colin!

And seeing as Mr Wales is a friend of yours and you seem to be the spokesperson of Team Wales why not have a word. You might be able to have a say in keeping a lane open. Thats what you want aint it?

Start another circle, I'm jumping off this one

 

[extreme-4x4]

team wales has no spokesperson.... team wales is just a bunch of people who want a bit of fun. they are more than capable to speak their own views

im just asking for information on this subject im not picking on anyone im simply asking questions..... a debate if you like

what is the best way forward for everyone

you cant start a thread and then when someone asks a question about it say oh i dont want to discuss it

its a fact some one built a bridge and did repairs to the sarn. and from what i read of terras post the bit with the bridge is now closed.

so what are your views on that ?
do you think its working ? (as separate groups)

now we could all sit here for john to have his meeting and wait to see what happens or we can discuss the issue that you bought to our attention about strata florida .

what is the best way forward that's all im asking.

yes i could sort out my own meeting. but that will just demonstrate to the greenies that the 4x4 community is divided.

to move forward there has to be a plan some ideas that include everyone

 

[extreme-4x4]

update....
i have received a reply from my email to john


he's going to get in touch after the bank holiday weekend

im betting he's on holiday

 

[dinky]

This topic is getting boring same things being said.

 

[Deleted Member D]

Rubber on wheels

If you have rubber on your wheels Im starting to think maybe you should drive on tarmac only.
Close all the lanes to motor vehicles that dont have tarmac on them.
That way you get rid of all the self rightous know-all twits trying to come across as the almighty ones.
That would really throw the spanner in their little works wouldnt it.
Personally Im sick to death of these pompus little no-bodies telling us all what and not what to do.
I have a natural respect for most things in life but have never felt so incriminated in all my life as I have since owning a 4x4.
The lanes are bound to wear as time goes by naturally and if no-one is going to repair them because of the cost etc then close them. Simple.
If you want to travel from one point on the planet to another off road then go to another continent. ie. overland travel.
I use the lanes over here because in my mind its off roading but I am told technically its not off roading because its a public road.
I like to travel from one place to another across land off TARMAC.
Im sick to death with all the shite that comes with so called 'greenlaning' and off roading in this country and most of the so called 'enthusiasts' that claim to fight for our rights to keep them open. Its such a divided and self rightous activity in the UK.
This is my first and probably my last 4x4 off road vehicle.
Want to go off roading ? Pay for it by overlanding or off road centres.
Want to get out into the countryside ? Park up in a car park and walk or cycle.
We pay for our highway maintenance system so why not pay for the non tarmac lanes too ?
Id pay to use them and to have them maintained.
Why not have some-one like GLass or any of the other bodies create a system that has paying members and a registry system to use the lanes ?
Anyone who has a 4x4 and wants to go 'greenlaning' has to register and pay a fee. Simple ?
The question of course would be policing.
Job for the bully boys perhaps ?
Nowt will get sorted bout it all tho cos it really aint that important to the majority of the nation is it ?
But at least we can do what this country does best. Moan.

 

[elty001]

in my ideal little world the answer is simple.
use the lanes on a rota system.
week 1 bobbles
week 2 4x4s
week 3 cyclists
week 4 trail bikes and quads
every 3 months each group does a maintenance week.
no one has to ever see the things they dislike,no body moans(yeh whatever)and we all live happily ever after:clap:clap:clap

 

[lacroupade]

in my ideal little world the answer is simple.
use the lanes on a rota system.
week 1 bobbles
week 2 4x4s
week 3 cyclists
week 4 trail bikes and quads
every 3 months each group does a maintenance week.
no one has to ever see the things they dislike,no body moans(yeh whatever)and we all live happily ever after:clap:clap:clap

I had to work out what a bobble was LMAO....could be rhyming slang!

sounds like an idea.....

 

[elty001]

it would never work as its meerley an idea by a simple peasant who doesn't have any one like n.a.s.a or k.f.c to back my ideas.:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol
this is not intended as a dig at any one as i think we all know the severity of these issues but it all seems to get a bit heated and fall outs occur and for what reason:nenau


sorry i have been drinking and i love everyone,you are all my best mates:bow:bow

 

[extreme-4x4]

what's to fall out about.

im only asking questions, if you dont ask you dont learn.

everyone said extreme air wouldnt work
everyone said you couldnt put 35" tyres on, let alone with no body lift too
everyone said you cant get 102cm lift without body lift

they all have worked and well

im here to learn, i really dont see the problem

if the glass or crag way is the way forward, and they intend to speek for the 4x4 community me included , as this thread started. why shouldnt i ask who ? why? what? and when ?

trouble is and i mean this
everyone says dont drive like that . or dont post videos of this ? or dont do dohnuts . the list of donts really is quite long.
so having refrained from doing this and trying not to rock the boat

why is it that when you ask a simple question like i have

why behave and why repair the lanes and when like the sarn they still close them

so why not do as the ramblers did 15-20 years ago and start to protest as one and not as small indevidual groups

people are very quick to show you your errors . but if you question them it all goes silent or they dont want to discuss it or want to leave the club

imagine going to a meeting with the council and the police and presenting your case for keeping the lanes open to traffic
then when they ask you questions on your plan . you go silent or say im not discussing it further.

i dont remember ever name calling or picking on people all i do is ask questions

 

[nejones]

You ask questions but dont like the answers.
And if the answers aren't to your liking you dont listen?

I like what you've accomplished with your truck Ex, I like the way you've pushed the bounaries. You have the right to do the same with greenlaning.

If you dont like what you're being told or disagree with it as you did with modifying oyur truck, then do things your own way. See what positive difference you can make, either with your mates and supporters or as part of the user bodies mentioned on this thread.

 

[extreme-4x4]

well im sorry, i really dont see what you have told me , that i dont seem to be listening too. all i get is look on their sites. but they dont answer my questions


okl think on this for a while..... this john or any of these other groups go to meetings with councils and alike to discuss lanes

and they present a case
now correct me if im wrong they want the lanes open. but often on a permit basis . so not everyone has vehicular use
they offer to do repairs to the lanes "sounds fair"
they want clear signage and sometimes one way systems
and self policing by means of video evidence

so is a permit going to stop people using remote lanes. what about the people who dont get a permit . do you think they will just sell there trucks and take up fishing. who gets a permit glass members or crag ?

doing repairs is nice but it don't stop the lanes closing the sarn is closed on the bridge section

so video evidence... great so you see a group mess behaving . so you pull up and start recording.... don't you think these bad people will get upset by this. i shouldn't think the councils or police will want fighting on these lanes
i wouldn't want my nose slapped for videoing bad people

but the first thing the council or police will ask is who you are speaking for what percentage of the users. how many people are going to follow your way if they accept your proposals

i just dont think its working as small groups it has to be one

i dont want to start a site, i dont want to stand, im not the type to lead. i have ideas yes but. it needs someone like mr lacroupade to get the job done. beleive me he's just the type to deal with councils. he has the talk and dont let go till he thinks he's won

 

[elty001]

at the end of the day col no matter what anyone does it doesn't stop the dick head mentality from doing what they like,where they like.
iv'e been into the 4x4 scene for 20 years or so and its been the same as long as i can remember.
only difference is the number of lanes which have been closed to 4x4/trail bike users.
used to get my back up(still does)but thats the nature of the beast.
let john fight the fight:clapgood luck to him:thumb2
i'm off for a ride on thomas the tank engine with the kids at midland railway centre then i might take the scenic route and do a few lanes on the way back home:thumbs