Starting anf Running Issues when Cold

[Banshee]

Got a bit of a weird one here, it all started last week on Tuesday, I was empty and had no fuel, was on the red, went to the Cash and Carry and put 60 litres of veg in and nothing else, the temp dropped pretty low that night and as expexted the car wouldn't turn over. Went to work on my bike, came back after work, jump started from my mates van and it was going again.

Next day, I had the same issue!!!! Again on my bike to work, jump start of van and was fine. That night I also replaced the Fuel Filter and filled it with Diesel and it started well, that night I also put 6 litres of Petrol in and shook the car violently

It just seems to be that initial starting of the day, once it's been started once it's fine first turn of the key and we're good to go again.

I left the car at home since Friday as Ive been away on work all weekend in Burnley with a few colleagues taking on a new business and integrating all their IT systems, got back last night and it took 4 mins of turning over before it fired. :/

And again this morning same issue to the point of flattening the battery, had to jump lead it and a whiff of easystart, there is now also 10 litres of Diesel in there with it

I know it's nothing up to the filter as you can see in the video, the clear pipes show no ingress of air. You can see in the vid that the engine is hunting and there is white smoke coming from the exhaust however this all dossapears when the engine is up to temp, those of you with well trained ears will realise that the car is under load there with a torch propped against the seat at 1000rpm for the purpose of the video and also to stop it stalling



Any ideas guys?
Cheers

 

[clivvy]

i suspect glow plugs :thumbs

 

[Fez_uk]

Could be the crappy soya oil?

Mine is running beautifully on rapeseed + 10% petrol.

As said above, i'd also test your glowplugs.

 

[Banshee]

i suspect glow plugs :thumbs

I get the clicking relay, whats the best way of testing them and are they pain to get out?

They are under the intercooler on the TDi aren't they?

Could be the crappy soya oil?

Mine is running beautifully on rapeseed + 10% petrol.

As said above, i'd also test your glowplugs.

I've been using it forever and never had any problems

I'm leaning towards the above of possibly the glow plugs

 

[rayf3262]

First thing remove the I/C.
The GP's are linked by a bus bar, before removing this it's advisable to check you have battery volts here when the GP's should be on, as there are connectors that can fail/corrode or even the relay although you can hear it "click" is does not mean it's working.
If all of the above checks out then remove the bus bar and check the resistance of each plug, all of them should read ~< 1 Ohm.
Any that read significantly higher will need to be replaced.

 

[Banshee]

First thing remove the I/C.
The GP's are linked by a bus bar, before removing this it's advisable to check you have battery volts here when the GP's should be on, as there are connectors that can fail/corrode or even the relay although you can hear it "click" is does not mean it's working.
If all of the above checks out then remove the bus bar and check the resistance of each plug, all of them should read ~< 1 Ohm.
Any that read significantly higher will need to be replaced.

You'll have to bear with me mate as some of that made no sense to me

When you refer to the I/C what is that and where is it located?

Testing the bar should be easy enough, presumably just make sure there is around 12v at each plug until the relay clicks off?

As for testing the resistance of the plugs, will I have to remove them to achieve this? Or will this be done in situe? What setting will I have to have my multimeter on to test them and at what point should I be testing the resistance

 

[solarman216]

I/C is the inter cooler, the bus bar link should read around 12 volts DC just after the ignition is turned on, if not then bad connection/wire/relay, if OK then remove the bus bar (4 terminals) and test each GP block to top terminal, should read low ohms as rayf said, meter set on lowest ohms it has(this is often the omega symbol a sort of upside down U with tails), hold the two probes together to see what your test lead resistance is first, might be as high as 4 ohms, then test the plugs looking for similar readings if above 10 ohms plus your static lead value then renew the plug, if more than one gone replace the lot, oh and do not get the ceramic ones, when they fail bits of ceramic break off, not good in your combustion chamber, there is no space for even a pin head, and the bits are a good deal bigger than that, Rick

 

[Lazy-Ferret]

Have a look at this from the down loads section.

http://www.nissan4x4ownersclub.com/downloads/workshop/wk6.pdf

they say a picture paints a thousand words...:thumbs

 

[Banshee]

I/C is the inter cooler, the bus bar link should read around 12 volts DC just after the ignition is turned on, if not then bad connection/wire/relay, if OK then remove the bus bar (4 terminals) and test each GP block to top terminal, should read low ohms as rayf said, meter set on lowest ohms it has(this is often the omega symbol a sort of upside down U with tails), hold the two probes together to see what your test lead resistance is first, might be as high as 4 ohms, then test the plugs looking for similar readings if above 10 ohms plus your static lead value then renew the plug, if more than one gone replace the lot, oh and do not get the ceramic ones, when they fail bits of ceramic break off, not good in your combustion chamber, there is no space for even a pin head, and the bits are a good deal bigger than that, Rick

Fantastic advice all I've been looking around and am tempted by some lucas ones, are there any in paticular that I should avoid?

How do you remove them?

 

[davenclaire]

i replaced 1 recently on my tdi i was unable to find any replacements for the ceramic ones fitted to the tdi engine, it does seem likely you have 2 or proberly more gp gone but its a simple repair

 

[stinka]

As I've said before I had this. After running fine on soya for 6-8 months it decided it didn't like it, getting worse to the point of mil light coming on all the time

Switch to rape, and as fez said 10% petrol when below 7 deg

Remove glow plugs and use jump leads to test

 

[Banshee]

As I've said before I had this. After running fine on soya for 6-8 months it decided it didn't like it, getting worse to the point of mil light coming on all the time

Switch to rape, and as fez said 10% petrol when below 7 deg

Remove glow plugs and use jump leads to test

Think I'll switch back to normal Diesel for a few days just to see what effect it has

How do you do the jump lead test with glow plugs then?

 

[stinka]

I hold the glow pug down on the battery neg terminal with a large screwdriver and touch a jump lead from positive terminal on the pole on its top

 

[Banshee]

I hold the glow pug down on the battery neg terminal with a large screwdriver and touch a jump lead from positive terminal on the pole on its top

I've looked around at various ways of testing them and am pretty confident in what I'm doing now

I've got my eyes on a few different sets of plugs on ebay, can't believe the price difference between them :O Lucas, Bosch and NGK seem to command the most money

How do I know if they are ceramic or not?

 

[davenclaire]

just buy them from a local motor factors i tried so called cheaper metal gp but the actual electrode was pysically thicker so wouldnt go down into the cylinder. take them out test them and buy the amount required. if you do find a cheaper metal one let us know. good luck

 

[Barrbeast]

Am I missing something? Why not just get them from Milner's??

None of their 2.7 glowplugs look ceramic to me and after all we do get a discount...

 

[Banshee]

Am I missing something? Why not just get them from Milner's??

None of their 2.7 glowplugs look ceramic to me and after all we do get a discount...

I've looked at the Milners ones and even with the discount they still come in dearer than the Lucas ones I have sourced.

The motor factor by me can only get Blueprint ones which I've bad things about even if they are £7 a plug I'd rather not risk it

Removing them from the block worries me the most, any tips for getting them out without snapping them off in the head?

 

[dave123]

I've looked at the Milners ones and even with the discount they still come in dearer than the Lucas ones I have sourced.

The motor factor by me can only get Blueprint ones which I've bad things about even if they are £7 a plug I'd rather not risk it

Removing them from the block worries me the most, any tips for getting them out without snapping them off in the head?

when I had my Vectra c the garages told me the glow plugs snap off . so they told me spray wd40 around them for a couple of days . then drive the car around the block to get a little bit of warmth in the head and use a t bar not a wrench or ratchet. and that works very well and when you put the new ones in smear some copper grease on the threads so they go in easier

 

[davenclaire]

when I had my Vectra c the garages told me the glow plugs snap off . so they told me spray wd40 around them for a couple of days . then drive the car around the block to get a little bit of warmth in the head and use a t bar not a wrench or ratchet. and that works very well and when you put the new ones in smear some copper grease on the threads so they go in easier

i did the same thing but used plus gas its much better than wd40 let the engine warm up a bit get the intercooler off move the rubber hoses out of the way take off the buzz bar more plus gas make a cup of tea give it 20 mins and T bar instead of socket.

 

[Banshee]

i did the same thing but used plus gas its much better than wd40 let the engine warm up a bit get the intercooler off move the rubber hoses out of the way take off the buzz bar more plus gas make a cup of tea give it 20 mins and T bar instead of socket.

Thanks guys

I was just going to go for it with some WD40 and an extended socket set, I was told not to attempt them warm as the can seriously burn as when the engine is running they are in mode 3 "After Glow" until the engine gets to 50 degrees :nenau