Key not locking in ignition switch

[Sampraz]

Hi,

just had my T2 in for MOT and it failed on a couple of things :

1) Windscreen scored where previous owners must have run the wipers with bad blades.

2) Ignition key can be removed from the switch while the engine is running!

Just wondered if anyone has had any similar problems with the ignition barrel not locking the key in place? Also, any hints on replacing the barrel if it comes to it?

 

[Deleted Member S]

I've never had a motor fail because you could pull out the key with the engine running before as I could do this on my old fiesta & capri :roll:
As for the ignition barrel i've never look at how mine is attached but if it helps most are held in place by 2 alloy shear bolts that once you have tightened enough the bolt head will shear off. To remove the bolts you can do it one of two way. You can use a hacksaw & cut a slot across the bolt & housing & try & unscrew the bolt with a flat blade screwdriver or the way I like to do it is lower the stearing colum down & use a centre punch & hammer & dint the shear bolt & then tap it around untill it is loose enough to remove with your fingers

 

[Sampraz]

Thanks for the advice on removing the barrel Sweety. I must admit, I didn't give the key thing a second thought when I took it in for MOT as I had never heard of them checking it before. I think the tester noticed it by chance when he was starting the car to put it on the ramps as the key is quite loose.

Do you know if the shear bolts be bought seperately from the barrel? Just wondering if it would be possible to get a secondhand barrel (with key) from a breakers. Suppose I could always use ordinary bolts to refit, but would be taking a chance on the security aspect. Mind you, not sure that an old T2 would be targetted for joyriding anyway :smile:

 

[Deleted Member S]

I know you used to be able to buy new sheer bolts but may have to come from a dealer :? If you are thinking of just replacing the lock barrel its self then you will have to strip it out of the alloy housing, I know some are held in place by 2 screws where others are almost sealed. If you do manage to remove it you'll have to be carefull of the springs & latches don't fly all over the place. It's prob the key locking latch thats worn out so you maybe able to get one out of an other nissan car in the breakers yard & just replace it. TBH replacing the whole lock set would be quicker than stripping the lock barrel down & rebuilding it :roll:

 

[tommo]

Hi Sampraz
Have a look at your key before you go stripping out the barral i had a car where i could take the key out and it was the key that had worn down. I had a new key cut, gave the barral a good squirt of wd40 i could not pull the new one out.

 

[jims-terrano]

I too would say check your key first, do you have a spare key to try?

I would look into this as I have a Renault Scenic that has a credit card thing instead of a key. You can remove this card whilst engine running.

Anyway the Ignition lock is held in with two shear bolts and yest they are available from a dealer but from what I remember from my nissan prats :roll: dept days they were a lot for what they are. Personally I would find some ordinary screws with correct thread.

Jim T

 

[Toolbox]

A bit of freeing oil down the switch wont hurt either

 

[Sampraz]

Thanks for all the replies.

Point taken Sweety re: stripping the lock down. If need be, I think I will just try and replace the whole unit as suggested.

Tommo / Jims-Terrano: I have tried my spare key, and unfortunately it's the same. Thing is though that the key I use as a spare is also very badly worn (there's actually a small crack in it!) which is why I put it away for emergency use only. Now don't know whether to get a new key cut in the hope that it works with my existing lock, or just to replace the lock and get another key with it. Local locksmith charges around £30 for a key incl chip, which may well be wasted if it turns out that the lock is faulty anyway :?

Suppose I could try a basic key blank without the chip, as it would probably be a lot cheaper to get cut. Wouldn't start the engine but might let me see if it was worth getting a proper key cut. Will also take a closer look at the lock tomorrow to check if I can see anything wrong with it.

I'm still not convinced that it is a valid reason for MOT failure anyway, but I have to go back again with a new windscreen anyway so may as well get the lock sorted while I'm at it.

 

[jims-terrano]

I've seen the crack you mentioned many times before and also the locks with the snapped off piece stuck there. I would have a go at a standard key and just see if it works and stays in the lock correctly. A botch job is to remove the metal key from the plastic handle and super glue the plastic bit to the steering column as close to the lock as possible, or find a way of taping the reciever ring inside the column trim together. Then just use standard keys but this will stop the NATs from working.

Just a bit of info regarding the keys.

The type of blank is known as an "X", this is the same profile of metal for the red dot type and standard.

The key has 8 cuts of various depths, these are symetrical along either edge of the key.

There are 4 depth's known as 1,2,3 & 4. 4 being the deepest which should only just reach the ridge on the key blank. Number 1 depth only shaves a little off the blank.

The profile of the combined cuts should be a pronounced step shape following the cuts, there should not be any curves what so ever. Any slicght jagged pieces between cuts should be so slight they can be removed with a wire brush.

If the key supplier uses a cutter that follows your old key forget it!!!! The only chance you have is for the supplier to cut from a key number so that they get the correct 8 seperate depths. The key number used to be on a white sticker in the glove box. Failing that take your log book to a dealer and they should be able to look the number up on the computer system for you, may be get a standard blank cut at the same time. Once you have a working standard key then a supplier who follows the profile will be able to cut a key for you. I would advise that you always have two working keys without cracks. A replacement set of locks will cost a lot more than a second key.

Hope this helps.

Jim T

PS I guess this makes me sound really sad :roll:

 

[Sampraz]

Hi Jim. Many thanks for the very informative post. I guess I will have to take a run up to the Nissan dealership and see if they can give me the key number and / or cut a blank for me. On both keys I have, the changes between the depth cuts are probably more curved than distinct steps as you describe, so I guess this could well be my problem.

Will have a word with the dealership and see if they are willing to cut a basic key for me first, as I don't want to lose out too much money if it turns out that it's the lock at fault after all.

 

[Sampraz]

Problem Resolved

Just an update on this that may hopefully help someone else out in the future.

As suggested above, it turns out that the problem was indeed due to the key being worn.

I called into the local Nissan dealership over the weekend and had the privilege of paying £15 to get the key code scrawled on the back of a scrap piece of paper :smile: While I was there, I enquired about the cost of a replacement key:

£30 for the key blank
£10 to have it cut from the code (which already cost £15 to obtain)
£40 to have the new key / chip recoded.

total of £95 for one replacement key.

Given that I wasn't 100% sure that the lock barrel wouldn't need replaced anyway, I politely declined and went along to my local locksmith. He cut me a basic key using the code for a tenner and it works perfectly as far as the locking mechanism goes at least.

I still need to sort out the NATS though, but may just stick my old chip on the back of the ignition barrel until I get it through MOT again. I've also seen some replacement key blanks on Ebay for about £15 which would allow me to swap my old chip into them. Now that I've got a clean key to use as a template it shouldn't cost that much to get the key blank cut.

Oh yeah, I also had to get a new windscreen fitted as the scores were too bad to polish out - one of the reasons I'm trying to save a few quid on the keys :smile:

Once again, thanks for all the suggestions & advice.....