Dale Farm...

[Adz]

As I said, my mum's side of the family are PROPER ROMAINI GYPSY'S & there's a hell of a difference which I can't be bothered to go into


& there not "Travellers" because they don't.! Until there moved on.!

 

[danielj]

If Plank was around he'd explain theres a world of difference between the two in some respects. Which isn't to say there arent dodgy Roma (witness that prog the other night about Romanian child beggars and benefit scams)...both parties are travellers by nature and both ethnic (true Roma come from India originally a thousand years or so ago) while the Dale Farm travellers are mostly chancers from the RoI who come over to make a bit (well a lot actually) of tax-free money and generally live outside the law.

Long-term 'British' Roma I believe tend to be much better behaved in general, although for obvious reasons they feel an affinity of some sort with the Irish travellers which I think can cloud some peoples judgement. If you've ever met a REAL Irish tinker you'd know that todays travellers bear little relation to their way of life, other than living it in laybys. In the RoI modern travellers (who are just as much an issue there as here) are often referred to in a derogatory way as 'knackers' LOL.

As I said earlier, I don't care what a man does as long as he pays his taxes and doesn't thieve from me or anyone else. Sadly, whatever the pro-traveller factions like to say, the vast majority of peoples experiences with travellers on the move is pretty dire to say the least. I'd suggest thats a bit of a contrast with years gone by but its a sad reflection on todays society.

Point about "REAL Irish tinker" is a good one. Don't think there is any of the "tinkers" that used to travel around fixing tin pots and pans etc. around anymore. Irish travellers originated I thought in large part with the past control of the land and property system and the poor being evicted onto the side of the road and travelling around from place to place in search of work, doing odd jobs etc. A set of customs, traditions, way of life, etc. then developed among these "travelling" people. As a group its probably hard to say much about them other than some seem to be quiet, humble, deacent skins living in challanging circumstances and others ................. The actions of some travellers are a problem in Ireland and it is unfortunate that the actions of some are also a problem to many people in the UK as well.
Think the issue and the discussion here is not really one of racism but one of the law and why it is applied to some in some areas one way and to others in other areas other ways.

 

[Liam]

Think the issue and the discussion here is not really one of racism but one of the law and why it is applied to some in some areas one way and to others in other areas other ways.

It's all about money, if you haven't any, they'll build a halting site right next to you, but if you have money, and can go through the courts, good chance there will be no halting site next to you. For Dublin, no halting sites in Howth, Killiney, Blackrock, Foxrock, Leopardstown, etc. etc. However, Tallaght, Coolock, Finglas, Ballymun, et. etc. Outside Dublin, you don't see too many in Kildare, Meath, Tipperary. But Limerick, Galway, Westmeath is a different matter. Funny they only seem to gather where the less well off live, don't you think?

 

[lacroupade]

It's all about money, if you haven't any, they'll build a halting site right next to you, but if you have money, and can go through the courts, good chance there will be no halting site next to you. For Dublin, no halting sites in Howth, Killiney, Blackrock, Foxrock, Leopardstown, etc. etc. However, Tallaght, Coolock, Finglas, Ballymun, et. etc. Outside Dublin, you don't see too many in Kildare, Meath, Tipperary. But Limerick, Galway, Westmeath is a different matter. Funny they only seem to gather where the less well off live, don't you think?

...or where they are less likely to get moved on I guess LOL.

Dan's right too....shame about the demise of the real McCoy....I remember about 30 years ago driving in Kerry on what was not exactly a boreen but I had to slam on the brakes cos there in the middle of the road was a fire - on the tarmac - with a proper cauldron bubbling away and a tinker sat there with his dog, red spotted scarf, bowler hat as it happened, drinking a cuppa, with his round-top parked behind.

Cheeky bugger never batted an eyelid and I had to drive completely up on to the verge to get round him....I'm still chuckling about it 30 years later :lol

Same is in the UK where 'real' tramps used to walk the roads and live in the woods, not skank about in town begging and sleeping in cardboard boxes.

I'm just getting too old, waffling about "the good ol' days" LMAO! :thumbs

 

[Deleted account DD]

you could always go and live in the woods?

genuine travellers are a thing of the past like shipyards

 

[harlowmaverick]

just supposing.......

What if they turned dale farm into a pay and play site?

You could dig a nice mud pit there for adz, a burger bar for me and annoy the rest of them that are left on the legal camp

 

[4wheel]

Perhaps the council will turn Dale Farm into a Caravan Park.??

 

[lacroupade]

you could always go and live in the woods?

genuine travellers are a thing of the past like shipyards

Do I look like Stig of the Dump? Don't answer that LOL...:lol

 

[(RIP) PLANK]

I have to move on from the racist word here to the real 'planning' issue.

More than 50% of homes in the UK do not have planning permission! they were built before it was necessary. Any home built before 1948 did not need it! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_and_Country_Planning_Act_1947 (it's not very accurate but it gives you an idea)

The planning laws were created before the race discrimination act, and the governments failure to ever properly implement the 1968 caravan sites and control of development act has lead to the current problem.

Plus the few sites built under this act are now mostly occupied by privately owned static caravan that are bought and sold on site, the tenancy passing to the new owner - you can't sell the tenancy of a council house can you? Most of the site house no travellers at all!

The influx of Eastern European workers into agricultural jobs traditionally done by travelling people has also had a huge impact on these communities.


What we need now is proper action to create space to accommodate the UK's own ethic minorities!

Think about it even the words the council's use 'Gypsy Site' or 'Travellers Site' are directly racist. We don't have 'Pakistani Housing' or 'Jew Flats' - no caravan a site is a caravan site and no more.

THE TRUTH IS THERE ARE NO WINNERS IN THE DALE FARM SITUATION IT IS THE SAD OUTCOME OF AN AREA OF SOCIAL POLICY THAT HAS BEEN NEGLECTED FOR TO LONG