Clutch/Gearbox again!

[arcascomp]

Sorry, another thread on clutch/gearbox issues!

I've noticed occasionally that my gearbox resists going into any gear, particularly 1st and reverse (I know, no synchro on these two) but only while sitting at the lights. Normally it's fine and I find I can get it into 2nd easy enough and then 1st is simples.

Yesterday, however, I started her up outside the house and I just could not get any gear to engage. Turned of the engine, put it in 1st, foot on clutch and started the engine. Drove off as usual and been behaving as normal again.

So, gear changes when on the move, smooth and slick (unless I cock it up!), when stationary not so smooth with the odd occurrence of 'feck off I don't want any gear!'

Normally I tend to change down as I approach lights, etc., and have a (bad) habit of keeping her in gear ready for the off so this hasn't affected me much, but it does worry me that something is possibly heading to a breasts aloft situation.

 

[Peasgood1]

Maybe your clutch is leaking and not as effective as it once was. Wouldn't be the first.
Generally speaking once I am moving I don't use the clutch to change gear, just one of my habits. Point being that you don't actually need to use the clutch as long as the revs are in roughly the right place, so you wouldn't notice if it wasn't working when in motion.
To get into 1st without using the clutch needs the revs to be more precise, maybe that is what you are noticing, alongside a failing clutch damper pipe.

 

[arcascomp]

Aye, did wonder but didn't want to claim my gear changes were all so well timed!

Probably is the beginning of a dodgy damper/flexi pipe situation, will need to get down under the old gal again.

 

[AD Ent]

check your clutch fluid level and undo the bleed nipple - long socket or spanner - until some fluid appears.

 

[solarman216]

Generally speaking once I am moving I don't use the clutch to change gear, just one of my habits. Point being that you don't actually need to use the clutch as long as the revs are in roughly the right place,

Bad habit, nice to be able to do it in the event of clutch failure, but you are putting a lot more strain and wear on your syncro baulk rings, boxes are expensive, Rick

 

[96terrano]

Used to have to double De clutch the Honda jazz when the old gearbox was giving up as it would just grind if you changed normally, that's when I learned how to do it

 

[zippy656]

Bad habit, nice to be able to do it in the event of clutch failure, but you are putting a lot more strain and wear on your syncro baulk rings, boxes are expensive, Rick

Low long one last if dont use clutch then?

 

[solarman216]

Low long one last if dont use clutch then?

that will depend on how good you are at getting the revs right, with your foot on the clutch the brake rings (syncros) only have to slow/speed up the first motion shaft and clutch centre plate and may be a bit of the main shaft (depending on what gear you are selecting) with the first motion shaft still connected to the engine you will be pushing the gear lever a bit harder till the two speeds are the same and it drops in, I think you can see that a lot more wear will take place in this situation, but I cannot put a number on it, as I say it depends how good you are at getting the revs to match the road speed in any particular gear, Rick

 

[swaggy]

Same thing was happening to me a while back - difficult to get in 1st or reverse when stationary but ok driving. One morning did the school run and when starting to head home couldn't get it into any gear. No noise or warning sounds.

Started the engine in gear and drove home. Bled clutch, changed slave cylinder, checked master - all ok. Ended up being the clutch plate. The centre had pushed completely out of the plate. Seems as when the plate was failing I was only getting a partial clutch release. I think its a fairly common fault - I hope its not that.

 

[arcascomp]

Haven't had a chance to look into it yet, but I hope it ain't that either! New clutch could be a bit pricey to sort out, will look into all the damper/flexi stuff first off though. Cheers for the pointers so far guys.

 

[Kishada]

Believe it or not i'm having nearly the same problem!
My problem gears are first and second with first being the worst.
Goes in to gear fine with the engine off.
Just changed the shifter bush this afternoon and it was nearly brand new.
Just replaced a leaking clutch slave hose in the last fortnight and bled the system hoping it might improve.
Suspect it's clutch drag from the clutch having nearly worn out as biting point is now pretty low.
I actually logged on just now and searched 'clutch change' and found this post, as I'll be going down the engine lift route to change it.

To get in to first gear now, I sometimes shift in to second then throw forward in to first to pull away.

 

[arcascomp]

The ol' second to first shiffle shuffle - that's what I've been doing too!

Stuck in work on the first dry nice day for ages that I could have spent breaking things on my truck. Still to even get so far as lift the cover off the clutch fluid and see if it's low. :doh

Have you checked the slave/flexi pipe/damper pipes on yours? Probably a cheaper fix than a whole clutch job.

 

[melissachels]

check dampner pipe, slave, master & adjuster on the master as this happened to me I thought the clutch had went as i could only get into gear either on the move or by turning off the truck & restarting in gear.

I did do a post on it a while back with pic of the adjuster bit.

 

[Kishada]

check dampner pipe, slave, master & adjuster on the master as this happened to me I thought the clutch had went as i could only get into gear either on the move or by turning off the truck & restarting in gear.

I did do a post on it a while back with pic of the adjuster bit.

Sound advice right there :clap

Turned out to require adjustment on the master cylinder adjustment rod.
It was at half way, it's now pretty much maxed out and working perfectly again!
Looks like i'll be replacing the master shortly which isn't tears as it turns out as I can get a Pagid unit for about £30

 

[Peasgood1]

Sound advice right there :clap

Turned out to require adjustment on the master cylinder adjustment rod.
It was at half way, it's now pretty much maxed out and working perfectly again!
Looks like i'll be replacing the master shortly which isn't tears as it turns out as I can get a Pagid unit for about £30

Been there, done that. It lasted just over a week.
I also went on to replace the master cylinder which also fixed it for a week.

Take the damper pipe out, cut the end off the pipe so there is a few mm plus the flare left.
Get someone to seal the end of the fitting up with a welder and then put it back together with the flare stuck back where it was. This makes sure it seals.
Just welding it up doesn't guarantee it will seal. (I used ptfe tape on mine but how long that will last is anyone's guess)

 

[Peasgood1]

ps. I mean at the flexi end just for clarification.

 

[Kishada]

Been there, done that. It lasted just over a week.
I also went on to replace the master cylinder which also fixed it for a week.

Take the damper pipe out, cut the end off the pipe so there is a few mm plus the flare left.
Get someone to seal the end of the fitting up with a welder and then put it back together with the flare stuck back where it was. This makes sure it seals.
Just welding it up doesn't guarantee it will seal. (I used ptfe tape on mine but how long that will last is anyone's guess)

Already recently replaced hose, then 1 week later blanked damper pipe, and both made no difference to the problem I was having (some and not all gears hard to shift) as it is not related to air in the hydraulic system. I believe the problem I have with 1st being almost impossible to get in to is developing from wear in the master cylinder bore causing less fluid to be pumped per stroke, thus requiring adjustment to increase the active stroke length, thus increasing fluid volume passed back to something representing what it once was and should be. The problem I was basically suffering was incomplete disengagement and therefore clutch drag. For £30 i'll be finding out shortly. If the rod lengths of the original and replacement are the same and i can set the new rod adjustment point towards the opposite (ie bulkhead) end of the thread then it will be point proven.

Arcascomp, your first steps should be as suggested by Peasgood1 so start with hose and damper pipe.

 

[solarman216]

my memory is very bad but I do recall someone on here having to weld the bracketry that holds the pedals in place so worth checking for this as adjusting the push rod would point to this, Rick

 

[Peasgood1]

£30 is a good price for a master cylinder.
I paid £55 in my quest for a cure.
Good luck.

 

[melissachels]

Been there, done that. It lasted just over a week.
I also went on to replace the master cylinder which also fixed it for a week.

Take the damper pipe out, cut the end off the pipe so there is a few mm plus the flare left.
Get someone to seal the end of the fitting up with a welder and then put it back together with the flare stuck back where it was. This makes sure it seals.
Just welding it up doesn't guarantee it will seal. (I used ptfe tape on mine but how long that will last is anyone's guess)

I did use some thread lock on mine