brynjdavies
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I've been having similar problems and will look at this as soon as I can.
Bryn
Bryn
fault code power loss under load
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jace
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i believe vp44 type pumps
brynjdavies
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Hi Badger,
Did you get the valve and if so where from?
Bryn
Did you get the valve and if so where from?
Bryn
Got one, but wrong one, have had two suppliers say it is not available, but friendly supplier has agreed to order correct one, and did admit that these cause many pumps to be sent for reconditioning.
he did say they would be harder to start, if faulty, when car parked with pump higher than tank, uphill, also gave me a tip to "get me home" insert a .6mm mig welding nozzle in pipe from pump, that’s what’s in at mo.
Other faults he confirmed were misfiring and loss of power, with or without smoke, and interestingly (read hopefully) loss of mpg!
Off to hopefully collect second valve (correct one) in morning, i will post part number, cost and picture when I have it.
but the get me home bodge has made the car drive so much better, no loss of power, or hesitation/missing, no matter what rpm.
If you Google Cummins return restrictor, you will see many posts, regarding this, with the VP44 pump, which i am pretty sure is what the Bosch Terrano has, the Zexel i am told is a copy of the VE/VP, we have ordered the valve for this pump p/t number 1 417 413 047.
I believe from here http://www.merlindiesel.com/media/48.pdf
the link shows it is a Nissan fitted part, and shows opening pressure, but from what i read, you can adjust pressure by changing the spring in the plunger.
if you look at the post where i showed a picture of return banjo bolt, it has a screw in end of bolt, removing this allows spring and ball bearing to be replaced.
Has anyone else seen one of these valves in any other pumps on the outlet? Does the mini filter I read so much about have a spring and ball bearing, if so why? I thought at first that the mini filter had been inserted in the wrong hole!
he did say they would be harder to start, if faulty, when car parked with pump higher than tank, uphill, also gave me a tip to "get me home" insert a .6mm mig welding nozzle in pipe from pump, that’s what’s in at mo.
Other faults he confirmed were misfiring and loss of power, with or without smoke, and interestingly (read hopefully) loss of mpg!
Off to hopefully collect second valve (correct one) in morning, i will post part number, cost and picture when I have it.
but the get me home bodge has made the car drive so much better, no loss of power, or hesitation/missing, no matter what rpm.
If you Google Cummins return restrictor, you will see many posts, regarding this, with the VP44 pump, which i am pretty sure is what the Bosch Terrano has, the Zexel i am told is a copy of the VE/VP, we have ordered the valve for this pump p/t number 1 417 413 047.
I believe from here http://www.merlindiesel.com/media/48.pdf
the link shows it is a Nissan fitted part, and shows opening pressure, but from what i read, you can adjust pressure by changing the spring in the plunger.
if you look at the post where i showed a picture of return banjo bolt, it has a screw in end of bolt, removing this allows spring and ball bearing to be replaced.
Has anyone else seen one of these valves in any other pumps on the outlet? Does the mini filter I read so much about have a spring and ball bearing, if so why? I thought at first that the mini filter had been inserted in the wrong hole!
Ok, more news, Zexel main dealer has now ordered part based on actual pump number which for reference is 104601-2031
Now for a interesting comment, this number relates to Ford, not Nissan, and guess what mine is a Maverick, so did Nissan / Ford make changes to power mpg ect?
Part number for complete valve is 9641-9461-615942
And is £13, should be here this afternoon, Zexel dealer confirmed all symptoms I have had, including cold weather problems and misfire and occasional poor starting.
Word of warning, they did say low pump pressure can lead to total pump failure, so maybe others who say Zexel pumps are not too good, need to look at doing this soon.
It would appear that the Zexel covec pump, which is a licensed copy of the Bocsh VE pump was produced to cover the gap before the vp was released, the name covec stands for “computer VE control”, so I assume pre tdi cars have the VE pump, not sure if this correct maybe someone can confirm?
Proof of the pudding will be in the eating, so I will report back with outcome when installed, also pictures of valve pre-install.
Fingers crossed.
Now for a interesting comment, this number relates to Ford, not Nissan, and guess what mine is a Maverick, so did Nissan / Ford make changes to power mpg ect?
Part number for complete valve is 9641-9461-615942
And is £13, should be here this afternoon, Zexel dealer confirmed all symptoms I have had, including cold weather problems and misfire and occasional poor starting.
Word of warning, they did say low pump pressure can lead to total pump failure, so maybe others who say Zexel pumps are not too good, need to look at doing this soon.
It would appear that the Zexel covec pump, which is a licensed copy of the Bocsh VE pump was produced to cover the gap before the vp was released, the name covec stands for “computer VE control”, so I assume pre tdi cars have the VE pump, not sure if this correct maybe someone can confirm?
Proof of the pudding will be in the eating, so I will report back with outcome when installed, also pictures of valve pre-install.
Fingers crossed.
lacroupade
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Well they'll have "Ford Part Nos" as well as Nissan I'm sure, but I bet if you quoted that same Part Number at a Nissan dealer he'd say its a Nissan part LOL.
Given that ALL these trucks were built in the same Spanish factory, it wouldn't make sense logistically or financially to be shipping in two lots of the same item with different part numbers....to avoid owners copping on to the fact that this was Nissan underneath, I'm sure part of the pertnering agreement would have been to use generic part numbers wherever possible so that the Ford parts man wouldn't always be saying "go to Nissan".
However, in later days they don't hold much in the way of spares so thats exactly what they ARE doing sometimes. Unless things have changed even Nissan get their bits in from Amsterdam if they are not in stock.
Yes i fully agree,
Zexel dealer has rung back, and said there mistake, part number is for all td27 nissan based engines, with pre vp pump, should be on van this afternoon.
If it does cure a multitude of problems, and is correct, £13 is good value.
how is sunny france today?
Zexel dealer has rung back, and said there mistake, part number is for all td27 nissan based engines, with pre vp pump, should be on van this afternoon.
If it does cure a multitude of problems, and is correct, £13 is good value.
how is sunny france today?
brynjdavies
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Just taken this dreaded valve off and yep I can just about blow through it so clearly not 14 psi. Rang up local Nissan dealer and it should turn up tommorow £2.50 part number 16666AD211, hope it's the correct part as it seems cheap for nissan. He say's he sells one about every 6 months so some people know they go. I've been chasing this fault for 2 years, I have enough power to drive normally but with my caravan it clearly lacks power so lets hope this is the problem. Will let you know. Mine is a 2002 Terrano 3.0 DI Turbo
Bryn
Bryn
he may be selling you the internals, it is posible to obtain spring and plastic bit, but mine is completly shot, so have gone for the whole thing.
also one diesel place i spoke to said they supplied restrictors not valves, so just a small hole?
does the 3ltr have a bocsh or zexel pump?
hope it does cure problem, on both of ours, like you say someone else must be replacing them, if your bit is correct.
also one diesel place i spoke to said they supplied restrictors not valves, so just a small hole?
does the 3ltr have a bocsh or zexel pump?
hope it does cure problem, on both of ours, like you say someone else must be replacing them, if your bit is correct.
Timbo_1975
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VP44 on the ZD30 afaik.
brynjdavies
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I recon it is Zexel but dont know, any easy way to tell, I do run Zexel software to read dtc codes. I did spefify on the phone the bolt through the return banjo, time will tell. I do'nt think it would be easy to replace the internals as it seems they are assembled from the nut side and a ball bearing is then forced in to tension the spring and seal the hole. I think they are all clones of a VP44.
It's been throwing a code of 0406 air/volumn problem, be interesting to see if that goes away after a reset and valve change.
Bryn
It's been throwing a code of 0406 air/volumn problem, be interesting to see if that goes away after a reset and valve change.
Bryn
internals of bolt, not pump.
In bocsh ve manual it offers options for overflow banjo, relief valve or restrictor, so one has spring and ball, the other just a small hole.
if zexel, should have plate on pump that says zexel.
yes zexel is a clone of bocsh, but on the 2.7 zexel ones a clone of the older ve pump, with added computer.
it could be your pump has restrictor, but would be better with valve, they appear to have made this change, when some cars had fuel pumps in tank?
we will have to see, still no call to say mine has arrived, its like christmas.
In bocsh ve manual it offers options for overflow banjo, relief valve or restrictor, so one has spring and ball, the other just a small hole.
if zexel, should have plate on pump that says zexel.
yes zexel is a clone of bocsh, but on the 2.7 zexel ones a clone of the older ve pump, with added computer.
it could be your pump has restrictor, but would be better with valve, they appear to have made this change, when some cars had fuel pumps in tank?
we will have to see, still no call to say mine has arrived, its like christmas.
brynjdavies
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Mine has also has a very very small hole in the bolt high pressure side maybe 1 thou I guess incase the valve seases shut.
Timbo_1975
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VP44 is the newer version of the VP37 or Zexel which is fitted to the 2.7.
Difference is the VP37 is dumb and has no electronics inside; reacts directly on an analogue signal to what the ECU tells it, whereas the 44 has its own inbuilt microprocessor and signals from ecu are digital to it.
There are mechanical differences between them also and the way they work internally- the 44 is a much better engineered big brother.
Difference is the VP37 is dumb and has no electronics inside; reacts directly on an analogue signal to what the ECU tells it, whereas the 44 has its own inbuilt microprocessor and signals from ecu are digital to it.
There are mechanical differences between them also and the way they work internally- the 44 is a much better engineered big brother.
brynjdavies
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Oh dear, might not be the problem, the leak I could hear was through the very small hole high pressure side, will test properly tommorow and even if tests good I will fit the new one whisky bottles half new you know.
Bryn
Bryn
may well be worth fitting a pressure valve if not present, read up on increasing pressure in vp pumps.
It appears bocsh at first said up to 25psi, then changed mind and said 5psi.
reading on the cummins website, the big fast trucks run upto 30psi, would not advise that kind of pressure but woth trying more than a hole?
again flicking through vp manual here, the choice of overflow restrictor, tends to dscribe restrictor on prepumped supply and valve when injection pump is acting as the lift pump, which makes some sense, does 3.0ltr have a tank pump?
If you get me the actual pump number off yours, I will get info if you want?
valve will now be here in the morning.
It appears bocsh at first said up to 25psi, then changed mind and said 5psi.
reading on the cummins website, the big fast trucks run upto 30psi, would not advise that kind of pressure but woth trying more than a hole?
again flicking through vp manual here, the choice of overflow restrictor, tends to dscribe restrictor on prepumped supply and valve when injection pump is acting as the lift pump, which makes some sense, does 3.0ltr have a tank pump?
If you get me the actual pump number off yours, I will get info if you want?
valve will now be here in the morning.
brynjdavies
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Hi,
There's no lift pump but I did fit an electric one at the tank thinking that if there was an air leak somewhere it would at least leak diesel but it made no difference. It is difficult to see the pump numbers but thanks for the offer.
Bryn
There's no lift pump but I did fit an electric one at the tank thinking that if there was an air leak somewhere it would at least leak diesel but it made no difference. It is difficult to see the pump numbers but thanks for the offer.
Bryn
brynjdavies
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Well the nissan part supplied was not it. The nissan dealer is 20 miles away but has a citroen garage 4 miles away which is why I ordered it over the phone. Anyway I went into a factors and they found what looke exactly like the valve but it is 1.3 - 1.6 Bar somewhat more than 14psi or 1 bar. Part comes day after tommorow.
Bryn
Bryn
