any advice on keeping livestock?

(RIP) PLANK · 16-04-2009, 12:56

I know a few of you out there keep a few animals Willow has already been pretty helpfull, so I though I would run this by you for any ideas:

I am looking to keep a few animals on a hobby basis with the possibility of a little profit, we are all registered with DEFRA as a small holding and have spoken to the animal welfare people so are ready to go!

My preferences are for Sheep and / or goats, but how does one make them pay as I don't want to just accumulate more mouths to feed. Any ideas anyone?

All advice (no matter how silly) welcome!

lacroupade · 16-04-2009, 13:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLANK

I know a few of you out there keep a few animals Willow has already been pretty helpfull, so I though I would run this by you for any ideas:

I am looking to keep a few animals on a hobby basis with the possibility of a little profit, we are all registered with DEFRA as a small holding and have spoken to the animal welfare people so are ready to go!

My preferences are for Sheep and / or goats, but how does one make them pay as I don't want to just accumulate more mouths to feed. Any ideas anyone?

All advice (no matter how silly) welcome!

how many acres Plank?

lacroupade · 16-04-2009, 13:18

and a couple of ideas....

first, don't give them names!

SHEEP - actually graze quite intensively and if you breed them you have to have plenty of grass area and/or budget for hay during winter months and ewe/lamb feed when they've lambed. Its a better bet to go and find unattached lambs (mother died or had triplets etc..) they usually sell for a tenner or even free.....keep them and feed them up for 4-6 months and depending on the market they'll be worth anything from £50-70 (even up to £100 recently because of the dearth of imported lamb stock).

But that means you only have the stock for a few months not all year-round (if you do the latter you need plenty of grass and be able to rotate to allow for regrowth/fertilising.

Better bet is pigs. But be prepared to have their compound totally shit up as they will forage until its a ploughed field. But heres the sums...depends on the pigs but we have kune kunes...

If you buy them registered (i.e. with papers) they can cost £100-150 each as piglets. But if you find someone who doesn't bother (and there are a growing number) you can get them for as little as £50 a piece. They don't grow that massively and are happy on a diet of windfall apples, carrots etc.. and 16% protein pig feed (thats lower than the norm but the correct stuff - its about £6 a bag and lasts a single pig 2-3 weeks when mixed with waste veg - a giant bag of horse carrots is £2.50 from your local co-operative) and after eight months we've been told by the mart that if we went to the trouble of paying to have them slaughtered and properly butchered, and sold the results ourselves, as hand-reared organically-fed animals the pair are worth approx £1000 (in pieces of course!)! I was stunned but they were adamant.

Trick is to keep a couple of sows all the time and know where to borrow a kune kune boar....

As a guide, we keep the two pigs very happily in a secure compound (chain link fence with a buried metal plate all round - they are escape artists!) approx 60' by 40'. The sheep on the other hand struggle to make ends meet if there are more than about 5-6 to the acre....people will kid you that you can go more dense but its crap....

Tony · 16-04-2009, 17:47

hi plank
tried this they become pets no one will eat them son taught the ram how to play rugby it would scrum down against him chase a ball etc, we gave them back to the farmer who then had the ram put down because it kept knocking him and his wife over
if you keep sheep etc. i'd keep the family away from them.
regards
Tony

lacroupade · 16-04-2009, 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony

hi plank
tried this they become pets no one will eat them son taught the ram how to play rugby it would scrum down against him chase a ball etc, we gave them back to the farmer who then had the ram put down because it kept knocking him and his wife over
if you keep sheep etc. i'd keep the family away from them.
regards
Tony

totally agree - the redhead won't let me kill anything....now its like a bluddy zoo!

(RIP) PLANK · 16-04-2009, 22:07

Thanks for the replies so far, I ike the pigs idea but I have been overuled so its looking more and more like sheep are the answer!

The attatchment to pets thing is something we have allready faced as we keep chickens and kiling a couple for dinner is something we have done, now even my 4 year old is up for eating animals and undertsnads where meat comes from, recently we had a sick chicken (egg bound) and she took one look ad said 'lets eat her' so i dont think it will be an issue, the kids are quite realistic. My 'middle' daughter is studying animal managment and is also pretty realistic about animals and their care and welfare.

We coudl set asside perhaps 2 or 2 1/2 acres but more if they mix with our ponies and that would make rotation easier, Im not looking to make a fortune, or even a profit, I just dont want them to become money pits. So just a few bought and sold at the right time would if nothing else pay for themselves. its just knowing when the right time is that is my problem

lacroupade · 16-04-2009, 22:27

pigs = less space + lots of profit and kunes are very friendly and manageable.

sheep are a pain in the ass. very little profit, lots of outgoings for winter hay, ewe/lamb feed, innoculations, shearing, fly strike treatment, transport to market etc (or sell them to a local farmer who will need a profit so you get even less).......i only got ours to save cutting the grass and with 3 lambs from the original four i'll just break even selling four of them in a couple of months time.

you might do ok with the lamb-only idea so you only have them 4-5 months of the year but seriously plank don't bother. get a donkey instead!

(RIP) PLANK · 16-04-2009, 22:44

well I am up for a pig or two, but the rest of my lot will take a bit of convincing, if nothing else we could have a good freezer full on the cheap, but i dont even like lamb or mutton so its no much use to me!

I will keep working on them

extreme-4x4 · 16-04-2009, 22:46

from memory
mum used to do small holding, the best way is to buy the young then when big enough for meat. kill em. dont keep nothing in the winter or have breeding stock cos you got to feed them house them etc
most places will take a trade for meat.
ie you give them 10 to cut up they cut them up and give you 8 back the 2 they keep for there fee

keep away from rare breeds. you buy for more and joe public dont know the difference

buy lots of freezers

most important
no names and no getting attached.

mum did the names thing. didnt pay cos she wanted to keep too many, little profit lots of work ..... gave it up

(RIP) PLANK · 16-04-2009, 22:48

funny you should say 'rare breeds' but that was one option my daughter has been exploring, as soe of them sell for good money and cost no more to keep. Just cost a lot to buy in the first place

and as usual its me who has to pay for everyhting!

lacroupade · 16-04-2009, 22:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLANK

funny you should say 'rare breeds' but that was one option my daughter has been exploring, as soe of them sell for good money and cost no more to keep. Just cost a lot to buy in the first place

and as usual its me who has to pay for everyhting!

well kunes as I said, if you get registered breeding stock the piglets are £120-£150 each!!!

extreme-4x4 · 16-04-2009, 23:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by lacroupade

well kunes as I said, if you get registered breeding stock the piglets are £120-£150 each!!!

yeah then you got to winter them and all that sh.t and mud in the winter not to mention the rain and snow.
let someone else do that.
if you just want cheep almost free meat and lots of it. maybe sell a bit to friends and family. just get the regular stuff already made. then just feed em when the weather is fine. and then in the winter eat em and put your feet up

christ you'll have him feeding them cider apples or a bottle of ale a day to improve the meat.

god i wish f gordon f ramsey hadnt been so f crap at football

i cant see plank having a stall at the local fete, selling spit roast aled pork with nettle and dandelion salad....... can you ?

lacroupade · 16-04-2009, 23:19

ah spit roast...mmmmm

(RIP) PLANK · 17-04-2009, 14:24

I have been offered pigs today (weaners?) young ones for £40 each i have no idea of the variety i haven't looked into it any further but i am tempted!

I also went to a livestock auction and market this morning to get the feel of things and gain a bit of inspiration!

lacroupade · 17-04-2009, 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLANK

I have been offered pigs today (weaners?) young ones for £40 each i have no idea of the variety i haven't looked into it any further but i am tempted!

I also went to a livestock auction and market this morning to get the feel of things and gain a bit of inspiration!

worth finding out the breed, but if you want them just to resell or butcher for a profit, it doesn't take them long to get to a good weight - if you had them now they'd be ripe by Xmas no problem, just in time for the market! and they are easy to keep and feed honestly.....household scraps (NO meat products or anything thats been near them!) plus windfall apples (people give 'em away in autumn!), horse carrots (cheap) and so on.

just give it a go....and don't forget DEFRA paperwork for movement....we had to fill in three forms just to walk seven sheep 400 yds up the road to a neighbours field for a little holiday!

what about buying a smoker?!

16-04-2009, 12:56	#1
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	any advice on keeping livestock? I know a few of you out there keep a few animals Willow has already been pretty helpfull, so I though I would run this by you for any ideas: I am looking to keep a few animals on a hobby basis with the possibility of a little profit, we are all registered with DEFRA as a small holding and have spoken to the animal welfare people so are ready to go! My preferences are for Sheep and / or goats, but how does one make them pay as I don't want to just accumulate more mouths to feed. Any ideas anyone? All advice (no matter how silly) welcome!

16-04-2009, 13:18	#3
lacroupade Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: All hail to the Glove of Love... Posts: 9,212	and a couple of ideas.... first, don't give them names! SHEEP - actually graze quite intensively and if you breed them you have to have plenty of grass area and/or budget for hay during winter months and ewe/lamb feed when they've lambed. Its a better bet to go and find unattached lambs (mother died or had triplets etc..) they usually sell for a tenner or even free.....keep them and feed them up for 4-6 months and depending on the market they'll be worth anything from £50-70 (even up to £100 recently because of the dearth of imported lamb stock). But that means you only have the stock for a few months not all year-round (if you do the latter you need plenty of grass and be able to rotate to allow for regrowth/fertilising. Better bet is pigs. But be prepared to have their compound totally shit up as they will forage until its a ploughed field. But heres the sums...depends on the pigs but we have kune kunes... If you buy them registered (i.e. with papers) they can cost £100-150 each as piglets. But if you find someone who doesn't bother (and there are a growing number) you can get them for as little as £50 a piece. They don't grow that massively and are happy on a diet of windfall apples, carrots etc.. and 16% protein pig feed (thats lower than the norm but the correct stuff - its about £6 a bag and lasts a single pig 2-3 weeks when mixed with waste veg - a giant bag of horse carrots is £2.50 from your local co-operative) and after eight months we've been told by the mart that if we went to the trouble of paying to have them slaughtered and properly butchered, and sold the results ourselves, as hand-reared organically-fed animals the pair are worth approx £1000 (in pieces of course!)! I was stunned but they were adamant. Trick is to keep a couple of sows all the time and know where to borrow a kune kune boar.... As a guide, we keep the two pigs very happily in a secure compound (chain link fence with a buried metal plate all round - they are escape artists!) approx 60' by 40'. The sheep on the other hand struggle to make ends meet if there are more than about 5-6 to the acre....people will kid you that you can go more dense but its crap....

16-04-2009, 17:47	#4
Tony Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: shropshire Vehicle: D22 Navara Posts: 442	hi plank tried this they become pets no one will eat them son taught the ram how to play rugby it would scrum down against him chase a ball etc, we gave them back to the farmer who then had the ram put down because it kept knocking him and his wife over if you keep sheep etc. i'd keep the family away from them. regards Tony

16-04-2009, 22:07	#6
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	Thanks for the replies so far, I ike the pigs idea but I have been overuled so its looking more and more like sheep are the answer! The attatchment to pets thing is something we have allready faced as we keep chickens and kiling a couple for dinner is something we have done, now even my 4 year old is up for eating animals and undertsnads where meat comes from, recently we had a sick chicken (egg bound) and she took one look ad said 'lets eat her' so i dont think it will be an issue, the kids are quite realistic. My 'middle' daughter is studying animal managment and is also pretty realistic about animals and their care and welfare. We coudl set asside perhaps 2 or 2 1/2 acres but more if they mix with our ponies and that would make rotation easier, Im not looking to make a fortune, or even a profit, I just dont want them to become money pits. So just a few bought and sold at the right time would if nothing else pay for themselves. its just knowing when the right time is that is my problem

16-04-2009, 22:27	#7
lacroupade Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: All hail to the Glove of Love... Posts: 9,212	pigs = less space + lots of profit and kunes are very friendly and manageable. sheep are a pain in the ass. very little profit, lots of outgoings for winter hay, ewe/lamb feed, innoculations, shearing, fly strike treatment, transport to market etc (or sell them to a local farmer who will need a profit so you get even less).......i only got ours to save cutting the grass and with 3 lambs from the original four i'll just break even selling four of them in a couple of months time. you might do ok with the lamb-only idea so you only have them 4-5 months of the year but seriously plank don't bother. get a donkey instead!

16-04-2009, 22:44	#8
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	well I am up for a pig or two, but the rest of my lot will take a bit of convincing, if nothing else we could have a good freezer full on the cheap, but i dont even like lamb or mutton so its no much use to me! I will keep working on them

16-04-2009, 22:46	#9
extreme-4x4 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: WALES Posts: 6,295	from memory mum used to do small holding, the best way is to buy the young then when big enough for meat. kill em. dont keep nothing in the winter or have breeding stock cos you got to feed them house them etc most places will take a trade for meat. ie you give them 10 to cut up they cut them up and give you 8 back the 2 they keep for there fee keep away from rare breeds. you buy for more and joe public dont know the difference buy lots of freezers most important no names and no getting attached. mum did the names thing. didnt pay cos she wanted to keep too many, little profit lots of work ..... gave it up

16-04-2009, 22:48	#10
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	funny you should say 'rare breeds' but that was one option my daughter has been exploring, as soe of them sell for good money and cost no more to keep. Just cost a lot to buy in the first place and as usual its me who has to pay for everyhting!

16-04-2009, 23:19	#13
lacroupade Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: All hail to the Glove of Love... Posts: 9,212	ah spit roast...mmmmm

17-04-2009, 14:24	#14
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	I have been offered pigs today (weaners?) young ones for £40 each i have no idea of the variety i haven't looked into it any further but i am tempted! I also went to a livestock auction and market this morning to get the feel of things and gain a bit of inspiration!