Diesel Demons

[jims-terrano]

With all the press that "dirty diesels" are getting at the moment. I thought I'd start a debate for people to air their opinions and thoughts about the future of our trucks. Theres a lot of hype about taxing diesels off the road, on todays BBC News website there is talk of a scapage scheme that surprisingly won't be available to all.

From what I read it appears to be cities that suffer the worst pollution, I personally rarely travel to or in a city. I've also seen public transport and goods vehicles spewing out a hell of a lot of black smoke which surely must contribute a lot to pollution.
So I'm just about to take the plunge and get another truck, having seen how a car reacts on impact a few months ago it proved how resilient these trucks are. Do I get another truck and risk the threatened taxes? Would any government risk taxing so many people?

[don simon]

It's fashionable to have a bash at someone and it generally sells newspapers. While an increase in tax will be most unwelcome, I can also think of other areas where there are contamination that no one bats an eyelid at. Air conditioning is a rather large player in this.
I would suggest that each and everyone of us has a general pollution audit and are awarded points like Part L, or BREEAM.
I have a diesel truck, but I also planted around 1,000 trees and watched them grow into humungous beasts. I sell ventilation projects that use either zero or very low quantities of energy to schools. The local authorities that install mechanical systems on cost reasons should be taxed.
Am I more polluting than a family living in a semi, who keepy the thermostat at 20 degrees so they can wear t-shirts all year round.
Look how many people stopped putting PV panels on because the contribution reduced!!!! It's not about how many pennies you can save, it's about the planet.
How many cars does the typical family go through in, let's say the life of Uncle Rustic's Mav?
While a tax may be coming, it's the usual short sighted, knee jerking, paper selling, vote winning rubbish that I see more and more of.
Tax diesels, but allow fracking? How mental is that?
I shall happily continue with the truck as I'm happy that in the grand scheme of things I am less of a problem than the vast majority of the public.
Scrappage will be unworkable too.

[solarman216]

Can I suggest that those of you that have not already signed up, visit fairfueluk.com and send their ready made email to No 10, They have made a good argument in favor of not introducing this tax, Rick

[macabethiel]

I think its all about money and the government could not really care less about pollution unless forced to by the E.U. or international agreements that not everyone signed up for.

Firstly let's look at why we have the current rise in Diesel powered cars. This was done to reduce the pollution caused by petrol powered cars and was encouraged by government.

The motor industry responded by developing diesel engines for cars and reduced VED was offered by the government as an incentive. Once we had started the drift away from petrol to diesel then the cost of Derv that had been cheaper than petrol became more expensive and the government introduced VEL banding to raise lost VEL revenue. As diesel is a faction derived from oil you have a natural split when you distill crude giving a pretty fixed ratio of Derv to Petrol

Now suddenly Diesel is dirty and we are killing people in the cities. The government is now subsidising electric powered cars to the tune of about £2,000 per vehicle. So the ordinary tax payer is now subsidising every new electric powered car to the tune of £2000 as a direct subsidy plus tax incentives for those paying company car tax.

So once again the richer folk who can afford a new all electric car are being subsidesed by the tax payer and the unfortunate driver of existing diesel and petrol powered cars.

All we are doing in the swing to electric cars is moving the exhaust pipe from the back of the car to the power station. At present we have coal burning, gas powered and nuclear power stations supplying the bulk of our electricity. Yes we have some solar and wind but if we overnight switched to electric powered cars the national grid could not cope.

We don't have big enough cables into the streets that connect to our homes to supply the charge we would all need to charge up mainly overnight. Then we would need to upgrade all the sub stations and cabling right up to the power stations that we don't have enough of.

Then we have the "Green Ground Huggers" who don't want a Nuclear Power Station or a dirty Coal burning power station and protest to delay building any new ones that we desperately need.

The reality is no Government will stop the freedom owning a vehicle gives us so they just keep squeezing us until the pips squeak then back off a little after we protest.

[macabethiel]

So it's another general election then Mrs May !

[jims-terrano]

Originally Posted by macabethiel

So it's another general election then Mrs May !

Yes so diesel scrapage wasn't discussed today then at the palace of westminster

[Monaro Pete]

Rick.
I have been on the mailing list of fairfuel for quite a number of years & I've sent many protest emails to various governments. If this makes any difference, who knows, but I'd like to think it does.
I recall everyone jumping on the Co2 band wagon some years back & we need to lower our Co2 emissions, because the polar caps are melting & blah blah.

We all had to swallow this bull shit & the governments have taxed vehicles accordingly. My Monaro for instance = over £500.00 a year road tax despite only covering less than 1000 miles a year, whilst a vehicle with free VED or in a very low band could cover 10,000 plus a year......... Which is more polluting!!!!

Turns out that Co2 emissions from vehicles have little impact on the environment, but have they decided to adjust VED accordingly, err NO.

It's a little known fact that it is far more polluting to produce a new vehicle than it is to keep an old vehicle going for as long as possible. To produce every component & build every vehicle creates more pollution more than the vehicle will produce in it's running life time, but keeping old vehicles isn't cost effective. They need/want you to believe that buying a new lower emission vehicle is better, because & only because it's more money for the manufacturers & most of all it's more money for the governments.

Unfortunately governments don't give a flying f**k about the planet we live on. They only care about one thing.

If they cared, we wouldn't pollute the water we drink, the ground we grow our food in, the sea we catch our food in & the air we breath.

Diesel cars in cities only account for 10% of the pollution, the rest comes from buses, trucks, industry & so on.

We are & always will be an easy target for all governments, but then they want us to vote for them................. That's the biggest con of all.

[makeitfit]

Yep, all the above

[makeitfit]

I'd be happy to sell my diesel cars to Mrs May for 2 grand each though

[macabethiel]

If Scrappage schemes applied to buying newer used vehicles that would help those who do not buy new. When the last scheme was running we at work were taking in as part exchanges vehicles that were worth less than £500 against £30k plus new Mercedes Models. Clearly they were trading in vehicles owned by extended family members not the actual customers cars. Nice work if you can do it.

[terranosaurusdoug]

Originally Posted by makeitfit

I'd be happy to sell my diesel cars to Mrs May for 2 grand each though

I'd be happy if she made it cheaper to run a 8.0l v8 in my terrano, and yes it would bloody fit

[jims-terrano]

Originally Posted by terranosaurusdoug

I'd be happy if she made it cheaper to run a 8.0l v8 in my terrano, and yes it would bloody fit

The tree huggers will love you but only if it's a petrol