safc air fuel controller

[zd30]

Has anyone used an air fuel controller to remap/interfer with the air flow meters signal?
I have been fooling around with hydrogen fuel cells for a number of years, and now want to do some experimenting with the fuel rate.
I'm playing with a zd30 engine this time.

 

[firebobby]

Has anyone used an air fuel controller to remap/interfer with the air flow meters signal?
I have been fooling around with hydrogen fuel cells for a number of years, and now want to do some experimenting with the fuel rate.
I'm playing with a zd30 engine this time.

Haven't got a clue what your on about, but it sounds interesting

 

[solarman216]

Has anyone used an air fuel controller to remap/interfer with the air flow meters signal?
I have been fooling around with hydrogen fuel cells for a number of years, and now want to do some experimenting with the fuel rate.
I'm playing with a zd30 engine this time.

Rayf was doing a MAF amp which is exactly what you want what it does is fool the ecu that more air is going in than actually is so fuel is increased, only helps low down torque though the effect tapers off after the turbo kicks in, look up the thread Maf amp, Rick

 

[Banshee]

Rayf was doing a MAF amp which is exactly what you want what it does is fool the ecu that more air is going in than actually is so fuel is increased, only helps low down torque though the effect tapers off after the turbo kicks in, look up the thread Maf amp, Rick

4 mins late :doh

Rick beat me to it!!! I wanted to say that and sound clever

 

[zd30]

I'm wanting to do the oppisite, I want less fuel.
The hydrogen will compensate for this.
I don't really want to install a simple potentiometer, I would like someting which gets a signal from the throttle and boost pressure sensors as well.
This needs to be interactive, something which can adjust itself to engine loads and conditions.

 

[solarman216]

I'm wanting to do the oppisite, I want less fuel.
The hydrogen will compensate for this.
I don't really want to install a simple potentiometer, I would like someting which gets a signal from the throttle and boost pressure sensors as well.
This needs to be interactive, something which can adjust itself to engine loads and conditions.

Then the only guy that I know that can help you is Rayf, but think it is a tall order, Rick

 

[zd30]

Ok thanks.
Just wondering what one of his units would do if it was wired back to front, to reduce the MAF signal rather than increase it ?
I will get in touch with Ray on that one .

 

[rayf3262]

If you going to play with fuelling on this engine I think there are some essential prerequisites:
1) an EGT guage
2) a boost guage
3) a method of controlling the boost pressure
Without these items you run a high risk of terminal damage.

The MAF amp will only operate from unity to around X1.2, so will not attenuate the MAF output. I am not sure how well reducing the airflow metering signal would influence fuelling, I think you need to verify that before throwing too much money at it!

Couple of points to note:
There is no boost pressure sensor used in normal running, the sensor that is there ONLY exists to check for overboost and its not to great at that either.
The fuel control on this motor is ultimately controlled by the VP44 IP, the control of this is implimented over a CAN bus from the ECU, not a trivial matter to intercept/modify.
It will also prove useful to fully understand how the EGR system works on this engine and how to safely delete it.

I would also suggest spending a lot of time reading the Australian Patrol forums, there is a wealth of info. there.

 

[AlexD333]

If you going to play with fuelling on this engine I think there are some essential prerequisites:
1) an EGT guage
2) a boost guage
3) a method of controlling the boost pressure
Without these items you run a high risk of terminal damage.

The MAF amp will only operate from unity to around X1.2, so will not attenuate the MAF output. I am not sure how well reducing the airflow metering signal would influence fuelling, I think you need to verify that before throwing too much money at it!

Couple of points to note:
There is no boost pressure sensor used in normal running, the sensor that is there ONLY exists to check for overboost and its not to great at that either.
The fuel control on this motor is ultimately controlled by the VP44 IP, the control of this is implimented over a CAN bus from the ECU, not a trivial matter to intercept/modify.
It will also prove useful to fully understand how the EGR system works on this engine and how to safely delete it.

I would also suggest spending a lot of time reading the Australian Patrol forums, there is a wealth of info. there.

Yeah....

What he said...

 

[rayf3262]

This link explains in better detail the reasoning behind my earlier suggestions:
http://www.chiptuning.com.au/nissan-zd30-engine-protection/

Paying attention to most, if not all of what is suggested here before you start introducing exotic gases like hydrogen will pay off in the long run.
Even without the additional fuel in the mix, most of what is suggested is worthwhile in it's own right.

This is a worthwhile document too, Patrol Y61 Reference document:
http://www.cardiagnostics.be/-now/N...estanden/ZD30 Y61 Reference Document - BW.pdf

 

[zd30]

I'll have a read of it.
I have been using hydrogen for around 8 years

 

[zd30]

mmm, liking the dawes and needle valves.
I have most of the other things fitted

 

[rayf3262]

mmm, liking the dawes and needle valves.
I have most of the other things fitted

I have no clue as to the negative implications of adding hydrogen to the fuel mix, but wanted to point out that a number of ZD30 engines have been wrecked mostly through excessive EGT's and or over boost. Just wanted you to tread carefully:thumb2

 

[zd30]

Yea, and thanks for the opinions, people like you are what makes these forums actually work.:bow
All diesel engines absolutely LOVE hydrogen, they run cooler and cleaner.
Until now I have only run 2.7's on it.
I have saw a rise in power, and an extra few mpg.
Don't get me wrong I have had things go wrong too, including a hydrogen reactor explode, blowing the bonnet up on a 2001 commercial I had.
But, I believe the systems are worth sticking with, and also believe I can easily obtain a 30% increase in mpg.
BUT, I need to fool the engine into injecting less fuel, and let the hydrogen take up the slack.
I know the 2.7 is a better engine to fool with, but have just rebuit my current sve on to a strengthened, galvanised chassis and have fallen in love with the old girl.
So I will push on with the plan.

 

[rayf3262]

Cheers,
The problem I see with trying to modify the MAF signal is that it really only has a major influence on fueling below ~2500 RPM, after that the turbo is going to be pushing in way more air than the MAF can accurately measure.
At this point the ECU fueling is (probably) more based on the turbo VNT solenoid position, 0%,25%,50%,75%,100%, so there really are only 4 stages of boost control and the fueling will largely be influenced by this.

 

[zd30]

Have you ever came across an Apexi safc air flow converter ?
When you get a chance try googling it.
I think it looks very interesting.

 

[rayf3262]

Have you ever came across an Apexi safc air flow converter ?
When you get a chance try googling it.
I think it looks very interesting.

Yes I am aware of it.
Before I built the analouge MAF amp, I had designed and prototyped a digital version based on a PIC microcontroller.
Basically: MAF in to A->D lookup table then D->A output.
I had of course planned on including the VSS and TPS info to modify the lookup but never got that far as it was going to be too expensive a solution for what was required.
The analouge box did what was needed.
I believe Jaycar used to produce a more affordable generic digital remapping box..

I also have the designed the basics of what amount to an electronic Dawes valve. It monitors MAP and allows the ECU to control the VNT up to a predetermined pressure, once the target pressure is achieved the ECU control of the VNT is depreciated until below the setpoint.

 

[zd30]

Very interesting indeed.
I guess the 1st thing I could try would be to limit my boost pressure to say 12-14 psi.
That should limit the volume of fuel in a very crude manner I guess.

 

[zd30]

Whats the deal with the signature

 

[zd30]

o it worked