An old question, A new answer: Spring or Spacer lift?

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dsgrnmcm

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 6, 2009
Messages
312
Ok so i spent most of today (apart from going to the cobaton tank shak with the old man) looking at lift threads, and ebay wheels and springs (all on Terranosaurus shop)etc.

1. What is the differance between a spring lift and a spacer lift?

2. What impact will it have on brake hoses and rad fan? Col pointed out the the brake hoses should be fine, and the rad would have to be modified.

3. Is a spring lift diffrent to a body lift?

4. My aim is to chuck on some ebay muds, and some ebay springs the HD 2" ones from Terranosaurus.

Thanks for any replies dan
 
Ok so i spent most of today (apart from going to the cobaton tank shak with the old man) looking at lift threads, and ebay wheels and springs (all on Terranosaurus shop)etc.

1. What is the differance between a spring lift and a spacer lift?

2. What impact will it have on brake hoses and rad fan? Col pointed out the the brake hoses should be fine, and the rad would have to be modified.

3. Is a spring lift diffrent to a body lift?

4. My aim is to chuck on some ebay muds, and some ebay springs the HD 2" ones from Terranosaurus.

Thanks for any replies dan

spring lift dose it on the springs, spacer is a body lift.

springs dont efect brake hoses or rad, spacers do.

diferent.. VERY.

springs from Terranosurus and muds will be a great play thing, lift teh front on the tortion springs..
 
well if i was doing it again. i would possibly go for a 2" body lift and shove some 33" tyres on.

that way your not messing with the running gear at all

so in theory it should still drive like a car, but still do all green lanes or light pay n play.

which lets face it is more than most will do anyway
 
springs dont efect brake hoses or rad, spacers do.

Part right, no efect on the brake hoses as they are made like a coil spring, if you look at the front where they run down from the master cyl you will see what I mean, you have to adapt the mounts on the rad & the front & back bumper.
 
Ok lets start from the beginning.

Types of Lift

Body Lift

With a body lift the body is lifted relative to the chassis using spacers.


Suspension lift

This can be achieved in 2 ways, using spacers or longer/stiffer springs, these lift the chassis upwards and the body too as its bolted on top.



So what are we looking for in a 4x4.


Good ground clearance.
Good approach, departure and breakover angles.
Good traction.

For anyone who doesn't know what the angles are here's a little diagram.
breakover.jpg



So how to we achieve these?


Ground Clearance

The lowest point of any half decent 4x4 will be its diffs. With solid axles like a Patrol or the rear of a T2 the only way of lifting the diffs is to fit bigger tyres. However with independent suspension you can lift the suspension to lift the whole vehicle including diff etc up, however the out board end of the wishbones will not lift in this situation.


Approach, departure and breakover angles

A little light surgery on the bumpers will help improve the approach and departures angles, but there's no much that can be done about improving the breakover angle in that way except ditching the side steps if you have them. The only solution is a suspension lift which will lift the whole body and chassis upwards away from the ground.


Good Traction


To get this you need to have the wheels on the floor with good tyres and with drive going to them. Locking diffs or LSDs (or no centre diff) will mean that you can get drive to a wheel whilst others are in the air but its still best to have as many wheels on the ground as possible and as many driven as possible. This is done by having flexible suspension that can conform itself to the terrain, to do this it needs to be free to move, this means no anti roll bars, soft springs and long travel - these do not make great bed fellows on the road though so a compromise needs to be struck.


Bigger tyres


Most 4x4s will accept larger tyres with no or little modifications, it might be necessary to remove the mudflaps or trim a fraction off the plastic bumper (which if done carefully is invisible) - on the T2 the biggest you can get away with is 31/10.5).

To go beyond this can involve more work on some vehicles you will hear that people say you need an X" suspension lift to fit YZ tyres, this is both true and untrue. A suspension lift does not allow you to fit larger tyres unless you also fit larger bump stops as the tyre is still free to move to its original position in the arch on large suspension deflections just as it was without a lift, if the tyre catches without a lif it will atch with a lift unless you fit bigger bumpstops - only a bodylift truly give you more space for larger tyres as it lifts the bodywork on which the tyres would catch relative to the bumpstops.

On the T2 in my experience of fitting both 265/75/16 and 32/9.5/15 tyres above is all rather superfluous as its not the height that is the issue on the T2 but the steel bulkhead that gets in the way when you go above 32". I have fairly drastically reshaped the bulkhead in this area with a large hammer to get it to fit. Likewise the front bumper needs trimming too, but again this can be done so it barely shows. A large enough - probably 3"+ - bodylift would probably do the jobas there is relatively little travel in the front suspension.


Suspension lift

Whether its changing the springs, fitting spring spacers or winding up torsion bars, any moderately competent mechanic can perform a suspension lift on most 4x4s in a morning. Some will require longer brake lines to be fitted but the T2 does not (not at 2" anyway).

Longer shocks are only needed if the unladen spring is longer than the standard spring or if the springs are going to be allowed to dislocate, in which case they need to be tethered and suitable relocation cones fitted. In the case of the T2 the standard front shock allows full movement of the IFS so there is no need there.


Body Lift

These should be supplied with a set of spacers and bolts and better kits with bumper brackets and anything else that might be required. A competent mechanic should be able to perform a body lift inside a day - or maybe a touch over it all depends how hard it is to shift the standard bolts as if they are rusted in it can be a long job, especially on the T2 were a number go into captive nuts in body voids so you can't apply heat to them.

As well as the obvious job of the spacers other task include, lengthening the fuel filler and breather, loosening wiring and plumbing that bridges the gap so as to provide enough slack, possibly relocation the radiator or its cowling downward as it is attached to the body where the fan is attached to the engine/chassis.


On the road - roll

Inch for inch a body lift raises the centre of gravity of the truck the least and thus it will induce less additional body roll. However a spring lift also give the ability to fit stiffer springs at the same time to help negate the additional body roll.



Personally I think bigger tyres and a 2" lift with HD (higher spring rate) springs is the way to go for a vehicle that is going to be used on the road as well as a play thing. The larger tyres will give clearance under te rear diff and the suspension lift will increase and the angles and increase clearance under the front too. A more dedicated play thing can go for soft and longer springs with longer shocks and then perhaps a body lift to allow still bigger tyres - but remember you still ave to turn them so lower gearing needs to be on the cards really.
 
agree with everything except the gearing. mine is on 35's. as far as im aware no one has gone bigger than that and mine still has plenty of welly. on the road its margially slower on take off. but at 200revs the turbo pushes it allong nicely. lets face it if it was bad it wouldnt have dragged the pathfinder on a trailer for 100 miles. it must have been towing well over 2.5 ton. ok i knew it was there but standard truck would too

it keeps up with other t2's fine
it still climbs anything iv got the balls for.

stupidly i went for the high lift but without body lift, as i wanted a 50 50 road mud truck. i think its there just the steering lets these trucks down misserably. its road holding is still fantastic and its like a tractor off road, with little roll.

ok the body has had major sergery . several days of cutting and welding.

the t2 can keep up with any mud preped landy and will outdo most other 4x4's with thousands spent on them. until they put the diff lockers on

a t2 will go into most places with little spending and modding

33" mud tyres either 2 " body or spring lift and your ready for some big mud.
 
I'll agree with both Simon & Colin 100% :thumbs
& can vouch for power with Colins truck :thumbs as it leaves mine standing :eek: :(

&

On the early Terrano / Maverick you only need minor front bumper & arch trimming to get 31's on :thumbs
 
Thats what i would pay hundrads for...

So 2" HD springs from Terranosaurus, and some big mud (maybe also from Terranosaurus) and that should do me, with fitting the springs will i still have to faff around with the rad?

Is there a down lead on how to fit the new springs or is it easy?

Aagin si & col many thanks (colin you know i'll be coming your way with a tent and some new bits...)
 
Fitting the rear springs couldn't eb easier really.

Undo bottom shock mounts - jack up body (not axle) till springs can be pulled out, fit neww springs lower body and refit lower shock mount.

Torsion bars adjust at the back of the bars - really must get around to doing some proper instrcutions sometime.
 
So 2" HD springs from Terranosaurus, and some big mud (maybe also from Terranosaurus) and that should do me, with fitting the springs will i still have to faff around with the rad? no

Is there a down lead on how to fit the new springs or is it easy? im told its easy. just jack up, compress spring and change over.

Aagin si & col many thanks (colin you know i'll be coming your way with a tent and some new bits...)

need my torsion bars doing still.. :augie
 
So 2" HD springs from Terranosaurus, and some big mud (maybe also from Terranosaurus) and that should do me, with fitting the springs will i still have to faff around with the rad?

Is there a down lead on how to fit the new springs or is it easy?

Aagin si & col many thanks (colin you know i'll be coming your way with a tent and some new bits...)


Just wind ya torssion bar up to the max

2" rear spring lift

31"s

Sorted :thumbs

You dont need to tinker with rad unless you chassis lift which you arent :thumbs
 
:eek: All 3 of us posted at the same time :lol :lol :lol
 
Fitting the rear springs couldn't eb easier really.

Undo bottom shock mounts - jack up body (not axle) till springs can be pulled out, fit neww springs lower body and refit lower shock mount.

Torsion bars adjust at the back of the bars - really must get around to doing some proper instrcutions sometime.

What about the fronts?
Is there a down load for winding up / indexing?

Dont suppose you could nock up a few pics? not right away,

If i order (via ebay/pay pal) whats the delevery time?

Is 31" the largest tyre i should go for?

dan
 
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What about the fronts?
Is there a down load for winding up / indexing?

Dont suppose you could nock up a few pics? not right away,

If i order (via ebay/pay pal) whats the delevery time?

Is 31" the largest tyre i should go for?

dan

do a search on here, load of threads posts about it..

31" yep.. but i dont know what that is in metric
 
with some light trimming and re shaping im convinced you will get 33" tyres on with a 2" lift

if you have the right rims and dont rush into stuff.
i could pop down or you come to me and we can set it up . take a couple of days though

33's give an extra 1" at the diff over 31's every little helps when your stuck
 
with some light trimming and re shaping im convinced you will get 33" tyres on with a 2" lift

if you have the right rims and dont rush into stuff.
i could pop down or you come to me and we can set it up . take a couple of days though

33's give an extra 1" at the diff over 31's every little helps when your stuck


We gotta do minor playing with mine to :naughty :sly

Click on my trip to wales link in my siggy :rolleyes: could all play then :naughty
 
with some light trimming and re shaping im convinced you will get 33" tyres on with a 2" lift

if you have the right rims and dont rush into stuff.
i could pop down or you come to me and we can set it up . take a couple of days though

33's give an extra 1" at the diff over 31's every little helps when your stuck


Good luck, I'm still having trouble with mine - now on 32" simex on a much more offset wheel and having to start al over again with the panel beating.
 
yes well your always going to have trouble with simex. due to the big tread sticking out the sides.

me and some locals had a debat about the need for simex and they were running on them. and we all decided yes you get stuck less but if your partly stuck they dig in very quick. 2 out of th 6 have switched back to bfg muds already and 2 are waiting to switch when they change next.. likely to be maxxis
2 are staying with simex

i know its horses for courses and you have what you want or need for the terrain you travel. but the point im raising is simex just stick out at the sides too much for a t2 tight arch

the right mud tyre an the right rims i recon its possible

i know people like this flex business. yes it looks impressive but when do you actually need that much flex.
ive never been stuck due to lack of flex. just chassis grounding out
and no drive left
 

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