serious Advice needed - Page 2

(RIP) PLANK · 01-01-2008, 19:15

I prefer bfg's as they have a higher load rating and if you load the car up and to this is more important! only 99mph? these are intended for a T2 not a ferrari

:

They also have bead protection rims and reenforced sidewalls the generals grabers dont have, I also used general gabbers twice on 2 troopers and frankly i was dissapointed, one flaw i have found is if they get kerbed a few times the first black layer peels and the sides go white!

also they seemed to clog up with mud easily and slip on wet grass, while on rough stuff and the road they were ok but in those 'marginal' situations like muddy grasssy fields they did tend to slide in place's the BFG and LSD cmbination will go in 2 wheel drive. So for a T2 i still thoroughly recommend the BFG's but as i say they are exspensive!

on the other hand if you only have two tyres need replacing why not go for a pair to match the fronts? and half the cost?

01-01-2008, 19:22

i tore tread blocks outve mine not sure if it was because it was driven hard on tarmac or what found them pretty good in mud!
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/WARSTA...02680052720834

andrewk · 01-01-2008, 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLANK

I prefer bfg's as they have a higher load rating and if you load the car up and to this is more important! only 99mph? these are intended for a T2 not a ferrari

:

They also have bead protection rims and reenforced sidewalls the generals grabers dont have, I also used general gabbers twice on 2 troopers and frankly i was dissapointed, one flaw i have found is if they get kerbed a few times the first black layer peels and the sides go white!

also they seemed to clog up with mud easily and slip on wet grass, while on rough stuff and the road they were ok but in those 'marginal' situations like muddy grasssy fields they did tend to slide in place's the BFG and LSD cmbination will go in 2 wheel drive. So for a T2 i still thoroughly recommend the BFG's but as i say they are exspensive!

on the other hand if you only have two tyres need replacing why not go for a pair to match the fronts? and half the cost?

I don't actually have any tyres that "need" replacing - but I "want" something better off-tarmac than the Bridgestone Dueler H/T 840 275/65 R17 that my Patrol came with when new. Nissan recommend that you have the same tyre brand/model/size on all four wheels, presumably to ensure that they all have the same rolling circumference.

There are only a few all terrain tyres that are available in a similar size to the original (i.e. similar rolling circumference) -- the nearest size being 265/70 R17. The options I seem to have are BFG All Terrain, General Grabber AT2, possibly Cooper Discoverer ST. The BFGs and Coopers were used on the "Long Way Down" Patrol support vehicles and seem to have done OK. I've an inbuilt bias towards the BFG, because I've had them before, but I've seen several reviews of the Grabber AT2 that reckon it's at least as good or better in use than the BFG.

One thing I do know is that the Grabber AT2 is massively better than the Bridgestones I have after struggling up a slippery muddy slope that an AT2 shod Series Landie in front of me walzed up, even though I have a rear difflock (which was locked) and he doesn't. I also know that they are cheaper, available and have adequate speed and load ratings. They are also a European design rather than an American one, so win out on that score too. :smile:

I'm in no particular rush to buy replacement tyres as the Patrol seems to do OK off tarmac even on road slicks - though I suspect I'm pushing my luck.

Cheers
Andrew

(RIP) PLANK · 01-01-2008, 23:25

the same tyres on all 4 corners is good advice on any 4x4 as it s the surest way to avoid transmission wind up!

I would like to put something more aggressive on my wifes grand viatra than the bridgestone duelers it came with too, but it is an odd size at 235 60 16 and i have even less choice than you! so i may just leave them on as they are good qualty tyres and as you say seem to cope with most things.

I thought general tyres were american just like BFG's?

andrewk · 02-01-2008, 03:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLANK

I thought general tyres were american just like BFG's?

In 1987, the tyre division of General Tire Inc - an american company, was bought by Continental AG - a German company and became Continental Tire North America, Inc which owns the "General Tire" brand. So - General Tire is an american brand owned by a German company. The Grabber AT2 was developed in Hanover by Continental.

BFGoodrich, originally an american company sold its tire division to Michelin in 1988 which is a French company. The remaining BFGoodrich was renamed in 2002 to Goodrich Inc which remains an american company in speciality chemicals and aerospace. The BFG All Terrain was launched in 1972 by BFGoodrich whilst it was still part of an american company.

So ...... the Grabber AT2 was designed by a German and is made by Americans in a German company in USA. The BFG All Terrain was designed by an American and is made by Americans in a French company in USA. Goodrich Inc don't do tyres. (I think)

Clear? As mud .................... :smile: :smile:

Cheers
Andrew

(RIP) PLANK · 02-01-2008, 13:35

well for my momey the french and americans come first!

also 2 first hand acounts, one loosing tread block on generals and the recomedation of many who have personal experience of BFG's

would have to win over a written review!

but having said that I, personaly am off buying exspensive tyres for any kind of off road use, I once scrapped 3 in a day on a submerged splintered sapling trunk.

I beleive that a mid range all terrain or a spare set of wheels with remould muds (insa turbo for example) would be a better option, and save money on fuel.

it is a bit of a confidence knocker to drive into an unknown swampy area with several hundred pounds worth of new boots on wondering if they will come out the other side in one piece!

buy something you can easily afford to replace!

expecialy considering the notoriously difficult tracking setup of a t2 / mav and the possibility of uneven wear etc.

(RIP) PLANK · 02-01-2008, 13:36

well for my momey the french and americans come first!

also 2 first hand acounts, one loosing tread block on generals and the recomedation of many who have personal experience of BFG's

would have to win over a written review!

but having said that I, personaly am off buying exspensive tyres for any kind of off road use, I once scrapped 3 in a day on a submerged splintered sapling trunk.

I beleive that a mid range all terrain or a spare set of wheels with remould muds (insa turbo for example) would be a better option, and save money on fuel.

it is a bit of a confidence knocker to drive into an unknown swampy area with several hundred pounds worth of new boots on wondering if they will come out the other side in one piece!

buy something you can easily afford to replace!

expecialy considering the notoriously difficult tracking setup of a t2 / mav and the possibility of uneven wear etc.

andrewk · 02-01-2008, 19:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLANK

I beleive that a mid range all terrain

If you can find some that are 265/70 R17 then let me know ........

Cheers
Andrew

NNMan · 02-01-2008, 20:18

I have had both BFG and Grabber AT's and I was far happier with BFG, they are both good on road, BFG are better off road and the grabbers couldent posibly match on wear, the side walls bore a lot on mine and went a bit crumbely and they seamed softer.

(RIP) PLANK · 02-01-2008, 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewk

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLANK

I beleive that a mid range all terrain

If you can find some that are 265/70 R17 then let me know ........

Cheers
Andrew

snap if you can find me some 235/60/16! I colway did them in BFG pattern but I have allready fallen into that trap once trying to get tyres for another vehicle. remember folks they have gone bankrupt!

NNman that was by big concern with them, the side wall, i have had two set where the side walls have et them down one set of AT's and one XP2000, general tyres allways seemed to work for Mr T so i dont understand it

: maybe he burnt the tread off long before the side walls caused and grief

:

JonathanM · 02-01-2008, 20:51

Andrew K has a point about speed rating, you need to fit a speed rating or higher as fitted by the manufacturer (H for a Mav, possibly different for a Patrol), so you can't fit some low rated tyre with the belief that you will never exceed that speed. As for load rating, my understanding is that the tyre needs to have at least a load rating for the half of the axle maximum, ie two tyres load rating combined needs to exceed the max axle weight.

Some of the aggressive off road remoulds don't have a suitable speed rating even for a Mavrano.

andrewk · 02-01-2008, 22:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by NNMan

I have had both BFG and Grabber AT's

Were those Grabber AT (which were universally regarded as garbage) or Grabber AT2, which have been raved over in reviews and by folks that I know who have them?

Cheers
Andrew

02-01-2008, 23:21

i had the at2s tore tread blocks out so tyres were scrap after that still loads of life left in remaining tread!

andrewk · 02-01-2008, 23:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by jace

i had the at2s tore tread blocks out so tyres were scrap after that still loads of life left in remaining tread!

Anyone can have a "one off" problem. I had a radial split in a sidewall in a BFG All Terrain with more than 10mm tread left a few years back, that wasn't due to a cut - cost me a new tyre. It's only worrying if it happens to lots of folks - and I haven't seen any evidence of that in BFGs or AT2s.

Grabber AT2s have a 60,000 mile warranty, haven't they? Did you take them back to the supplier? BFGs don't have any warranty in the UK, AFAIK.

Cheers
Andrew

02-01-2008, 23:50

gutted i didnt know about warranty i quite liked them aswell handled pretty good on road for knobly tyre they wouldve been covered aswell truck only done 53 k when i bought it,trouble was i bought truck in clackton on see essex would i have to returned to suplier down there or could i visited local one knowing that id have them on again and if they broke take em back

01-01-2008, 19:15	#16
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	I prefer bfg's as they have a higher load rating and if you load the car up and to this is more important! only 99mph? these are intended for a T2 not a ferrari : They also have bead protection rims and reenforced sidewalls the generals grabers dont have, I also used general gabbers twice on 2 troopers and frankly i was dissapointed, one flaw i have found is if they get kerbed a few times the first black layer peels and the sides go white! also they seemed to clog up with mud easily and slip on wet grass, while on rough stuff and the road they were ok but in those 'marginal' situations like muddy grasssy fields they did tend to slide in place's the BFG and LSD cmbination will go in 2 wheel drive. So for a T2 i still thoroughly recommend the BFG's but as i say they are exspensive! on the other hand if you only have two tyres need replacing why not go for a pair to match the fronts? and half the cost?

01-01-2008, 19:22	#17
jace Guest Posts: n/a	i tore tread blocks outve mine not sure if it was because it was driven hard on tarmac or what found them pretty good in mud! http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/WARSTA...02680052720834

01-01-2008, 23:25	#19
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	the same tyres on all 4 corners is good advice on any 4x4 as it s the surest way to avoid transmission wind up! I would like to put something more aggressive on my wifes grand viatra than the bridgestone duelers it came with too, but it is an odd size at 235 60 16 and i have even less choice than you! so i may just leave them on as they are good qualty tyres and as you say seem to cope with most things. I thought general tyres were american just like BFG's?

02-01-2008, 13:35	#21
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	well for my momey the french and americans come first! also 2 first hand acounts, one loosing tread block on generals and the recomedation of many who have personal experience of BFG's would have to win over a written review! but having said that I, personaly am off buying exspensive tyres for any kind of off road use, I once scrapped 3 in a day on a submerged splintered sapling trunk. I beleive that a mid range all terrain or a spare set of wheels with remould muds (insa turbo for example) would be a better option, and save money on fuel. it is a bit of a confidence knocker to drive into an unknown swampy area with several hundred pounds worth of new boots on wondering if they will come out the other side in one piece! *buy something you can easily afford to replace!* expecialy considering the notoriously difficult tracking setup of a t2 / mav and the possibility of uneven wear etc.

02-01-2008, 13:36	#22
(RIP) PLANK Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Central England, in the Heart of the Black Country Vehicle: T2 2004 TDI SE LWB Posts: 7,740	well for my momey the french and americans come first! also 2 first hand acounts, one loosing tread block on generals and the recomedation of many who have personal experience of BFG's would have to win over a written review! but having said that I, personaly am off buying exspensive tyres for any kind of off road use, I once scrapped 3 in a day on a submerged splintered sapling trunk. I beleive that a mid range all terrain or a spare set of wheels with remould muds (insa turbo for example) would be a better option, and save money on fuel. it is a bit of a confidence knocker to drive into an unknown swampy area with several hundred pounds worth of new boots on wondering if they will come out the other side in one piece! *buy something you can easily afford to replace!* expecialy considering the notoriously difficult tracking setup of a t2 / mav and the possibility of uneven wear etc.

02-01-2008, 20:18	#24
NNMan Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: West Scotland Posts: 575	I have had both BFG and Grabber AT's and I was far happier with BFG, they are both good on road, BFG are better off road and the grabbers couldent posibly match on wear, the side walls bore a lot on mine and went a bit crumbely and they seamed softer.

02-01-2008, 20:51	#26
JonathanM Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Merseyside Posts: 1,048	Andrew K has a point about speed rating, you need to fit a speed rating or higher as fitted by the manufacturer (H for a Mav, possibly different for a Patrol), so you can't fit some low rated tyre with the belief that you will never exceed that speed. As for load rating, my understanding is that the tyre needs to have at least a load rating for the half of the axle maximum, ie two tyres load rating combined needs to exceed the max axle weight. Some of the aggressive off road remoulds don't have a suitable speed rating even for a Mavrano.

02-01-2008, 23:21	#28
jace Guest Posts: n/a	i had the at2s tore tread blocks out so tyres were scrap after that still loads of life left in remaining tread!

02-01-2008, 23:50	#30
jace Guest Posts: n/a	gutted i didnt know about warranty i quite liked them aswell handled pretty good on road for knobly tyre they wouldve been covered aswell truck only done 53 k when i bought it,trouble was i bought truck in clackton on see essex would i have to returned to suplier down there or could i visited local one knowing that id have them on again and if they broke take em back