Paris - Page 2

terrano bob · 15-11-2015, 00:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas-the-Terrano2

Just a polite reminder of the sticky in this section:

http://www.nissan4x4ownersclub.com/f...ad.php?t=11735

Posts that could be deemed racist or personal insults
Whilst I’m sure we all have our views and opinions on where we stand regarding other cultures and UK immigration laws, this site is not the place for those views to be aired.

British law makes it an offence to insight racial hatred and, to be quite frank, some of the recent posts here have been very a very close call…. there is a very thin line between a joke and an offence being committed.

Secondly, personal insults aimed at other members are not welcome here.

So here’s the deal, from now on any posts that remotely fall into the above will be deleted and a PM sent to the poster referring them to this post. Continuation to do so will result in account deletion.

This isn’t open to debate and is the FINAL word ref BAT21

solarman216 · 15-11-2015, 01:24

Agreed, it was getting a bit near the mark, Rick

melissachels · 15-11-2015, 02:41

I feel deep sympathy for all affected all over the world by mindless killing, be it over religion or land.

I dream of the day when man accepts that a man's beliefs are his own without subjecting others to it and that land belongs to no man.

We are all from the same indecisive matter created far off in space billions of years ago. Humans, plants, animals, water, air, even the plant, Sun, moon and stars all originated from the same matter....the only difference is chemical make up. Even the metals and minerals used to create man made things were created the same way.

When I say man, I mean the human race.

Sent from my HTC One M8s using Tapatalk

solarman216 · 15-11-2015, 03:40

I agree with your point Mel, but unfortunately, it is not to be, you only have to look back on history to see that it is a utopia that we will never find, all we can do is try to limit the effects of the purbitrators by closing our borders, but with current government and EU laws this will not happen , so of the many migrants entering our country's a high percentage will be of violent ilks, what will be will be, Rick

Daemo · 15-11-2015, 11:54

With all the migrants coming into the country and not truelly knowing who they are with all made up names and backgrounds before we know it the enemy will be within. How long before we have a muslim prime minister making the decisions...

Paris attacks will become more and more regular which is very sad, but until something is done i am affraid nothing will change.

don simon · 15-11-2015, 12:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daemo

With all the migrants coming into the country and not truelly knowing who they are with all made up names and backgrounds before we know it the enemy will be within. How long before we have a muslim prime minister making the decisions...

Paris attacks will become more and more regular which is very sad, but until something is done i am affraid nothing will change.

You make that sound like a bad thing.... hey ho.

terranosaurusdoug · 15-11-2015, 12:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by don simon

You make that sound like a bad thing.... hey ho.

personally I think it would be, I don't believe any religion should be allowed to influence the way a country is governed!

don simon · 15-11-2015, 12:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by terranosaurusdoug

personally I think it would be, I don't believe any religion should be allowed to influence the way a country is governed!

That's the point.
Why do you think that religion would drive a muslim leader. If we look at it another way, the KKK is based on Christian doctrine. Do you now want a Christian leader of this ilk?

Not all Muslims are extremists.

I'm out as I'm not gettingh into an argument about this. But I do worry about certain attitudes.

macabethiel · 15-11-2015, 12:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by melissachels

I feel deep sympathy for all affected all over the world by mindless killing, be it over religion or land.

I dream of the day when man accepts that a man's beliefs are his own without subjecting others to it and that land belongs to no man.

We are all from the same indecisive matter created far off in space billions of years ago. Humans, plants, animals, water, air, even the plant, Sun, moon and stars all originated from the same matter....the only difference is chemical make up. Even the metals and minerals used to create man made things were created the same way.

When I say man, I mean the human race.

Sent from my HTC One M8s using Tapatalk

Very true I agree with your comments.

About 2 years ago I read a book titled "Born to Win" written by two authors Muriel James & Dorothy Jongeward. It was my first venture into human psychology and had been recommended by a friend. I sourced a used copy on flea bay for less than £5.00.

I found the book to be quite an eye opener in my understanding of how we interact with each other.
It is not heavy reading and the sections on Family Scripts, Cultural Scripts & Religous Scripts helped me understand some of my own behaviour.

I was moulded by my slightly unusual upbringing and it helped me have a better relationship with my half-brother and explained the shared values we have and how though our lives are quite different we are in so many ways similar .

terranosaurusdoug · 15-11-2015, 12:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by don simon

That's the point.
Why do you think that religion would drive a muslim leader. If we look at it another way, the KKK is based on Christian doctrine. Do you now want a Christian leader of this ilk?

Not all Muslims are extremists.

I'm out as I'm not gettingh into an argument about this. But I do worry about certain attitudes.

I think you may have missed my point, I don't think ANY religion should be a part of politics, there aren't to many atheists however. A person does not have to be an extremist for their religion to affect their decisions, whether big or small!
Please do not think I am intolerant or a biggot, I believe people are people, it's what we do with our life that makes us different from one another!!

macabethiel · 15-11-2015, 12:41

P.S. I should declare that although I am a White European I did not come to the UK until I was 5 years old and became a British Citizen when I was 14 years old.

I was born in Austria, when Hitler invaded my mother was 12 years old she never saw her Jewish neighbours again after they were arrested by the Gestapo.
My mother was very good at running when she was at school but was stopped from engaging in this sport as she did not look Aryan enough!
My brother still has the original copy of Mein Kampf she was issued at school - it is written in Gothic Script !

terranosaurusdoug · 15-11-2015, 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by macabethiel

My mother was very good at running when she was at school but was stopped from engaging in this sport as she did not look Aryan enough!
My brother still has the original copy of Mein Kampf she was issued at school - it is written in Gothic Script !

That is scary!! I worry about stuff like that happening again, in any country, I think most people think its impossible, but it's something we have to vigilant about, that's just me tho!

Lazy-Ferret · 15-11-2015, 16:59

The problem is, and the press make this very difficult to differentiate, Religion, social status, nationality and immigration have nothing to do directly with the conversation relating to what happened in Paris.

Saying all Muslims are terrorist, because of what is happening currently, is like saying all Catholics are terrorists, because of what happened in northern Ireland, or all Christians are terrorists, because of the crusades/witches/Indians/aborigines/....The same with the whole Israel/Palestine issues at the moment, depending on what side of the fence you were born, or care to look at it, both nationalities are terrorists. The list goes on and on..

Religion as a whole, what ever the faith, is ultimately a brain washing cult, and cults seem to get people doing bad things to others, but it's not just cults, anywhere you can group people under a single name, and then get them all together, bad things can happen. Look at us as a group of Nissan lovers, we are rightly or wrongly, (an usually jokingly) intolerant of LR's, and reading the forum, you would think we would never tolerate a landrover driver to even read our posts, yet there are actually many members who (secretly) either have/do/or aspire to owning one.

It seems that as soon as two people have differing opinions, they can't live and let live, they have to convert the other person to their way of thinking, and when these people get into groups, by the laws of averages, you are going to get some people in that group that are hardcore, and take things a bit too far. Since religion is such a personal thing to most people, matters are made far worse as it then involves emotions about what is after all, a hypothetical belief of both people.

Guys, please put this topic back into perspective, and don't let the cowards win by causing division every where....

These people are a minority group of cowards, who like the bully at school, seek to further their nefarious cause by causing havoc, and using anything handy to their cause as an excuse to do this. Because of hundreds of years of bad things being done in the call of religion, it is an intrinsically ingrained instinct for humans to react to this, and it always blows out of control, making it perfect for their desires.

Ironically, with the internet giving access to unbiased information at the click of a button, this should now be easy to cure, but still people let other people with their own agendas, like the press, and politicians, dictate what they think, instead of reading both sides of the story and making their own mind up. It's those that do read all sides when it comes to religion, that are becoming atheists, as they do not want to be associated with any one religion

Please stick to the facts....

A group of cowards called ISIS did this.

Stop including the other huge group of Ummah who live their life by a honourable set of rules, just like the majority of jews, druids, wiccans, christians, and buddhists. Remember too, that some of the members of ISIS are were actually, "christian" people who have converted to Muslim so they can go and join them.

From my point of view, as someone brought up as a Christian, and who is still surrounded by many, I have made my own personal views about how to live my life, just like most sane, normal, religious people. Sadly, some of the worst people I have ever met, have supposedly, been Christians, and some of the nicest, have been Muslims, and in the same vain, being part of a volunteer 4x4 group, some of the nicest, considerate, helpful people I have met are landrover drivers, one or two are even Muslim landrover drivers.... god forbid!!! The thing is, when we are doing good work, and helping other people, who cares what our beliefs are, so why should we suddenly care when bad things happen?

terranosaurusdoug · 15-11-2015, 17:27

Hello Mr ferret, can you please refrain from using that term so often, I find it distasteful and offensive, if people want to drive L..d R....s that is their business, but I for one want no part of it!

Otherwise well written brother, well written

johnb5177 · 15-11-2015, 18:14

Clive

+1, yes well thought out and written......

15-11-2015, 01:24	#17
solarman216 Off road maniac Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Bexhill on Sea Vehicle: Y60 Patrol Me, 3 ltr Mrs Posts: 17,431	Agreed, it was getting a bit near the mark, Rick __________________ Ex banger racer now off road maniac Lokka on the front with manual hubs Diff lock on rear 3 inch SS straight through exhaust Manly winch bumper with 13000 lb winch 10 spike ground anchor, with multiple straps and blocks Super strong body cills capped with scaffold pole 20% stronger springs all round aggressive off road tyres on wheels so just swap. Aim to get stuck and be completely self sufficient in extraction, love getting muddy, 2ft deep is good but rare.

15-11-2015, 03:40	#19
solarman216 Off road maniac Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Bexhill on Sea Vehicle: Y60 Patrol Me, 3 ltr Mrs Posts: 17,431	I agree with your point Mel, but unfortunately, it is not to be, you only have to look back on history to see that it is a utopia that we will never find, all we can do is try to limit the effects of the purbitrators by closing our borders, but with current government and EU laws this will not happen , so of the many migrants entering our country's a high percentage will be of violent ilks, what will be will be, Rick __________________ Ex banger racer now off road maniac Lokka on the front with manual hubs Diff lock on rear 3 inch SS straight through exhaust Manly winch bumper with 13000 lb winch 10 spike ground anchor, with multiple straps and blocks Super strong body cills capped with scaffold pole 20% stronger springs all round aggressive off road tyres on wheels so just swap. Aim to get stuck and be completely self sufficient in extraction, love getting muddy, 2ft deep is good but rare.

15-11-2015, 02:41	#18
melissachels Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Near Armagh, Northern Ireland Vehicle: half of a T2 2.7td swb Posts: 1,216	I feel deep sympathy for all affected all over the world by mindless killing, be it over religion or land. I dream of the day when man accepts that a man's beliefs are his own without subjecting others to it and that land belongs to no man. We are all from the same indecisive matter created far off in space billions of years ago. Humans, plants, animals, water, air, even the plant, Sun, moon and stars all originated from the same matter....the only difference is chemical make up. Even the metals and minerals used to create man made things were created the same way. When I say man, I mean the human race. Sent from my HTC One M8s using Tapatalk

15-11-2015, 11:54	#20
Daemo Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Northamptonshire Vehicle: Patrol y61, safari y60. Posts: 466	With all the migrants coming into the country and not truelly knowing who they are with all made up names and backgrounds before we know it the enemy will be within. How long before we have a muslim prime minister making the decisions... Paris attacks will become more and more regular which is very sad, but until something is done i am affraid nothing will change.

15-11-2015, 12:41	#26
macabethiel Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Derby Vehicle: Freelander & Jeep GC 3.0 Posts: 4,416	P.S. I should declare that although I am a White European I did not come to the UK until I was 5 years old and became a British Citizen when I was 14 years old. I was born in Austria, when Hitler invaded my mother was 12 years old she never saw her Jewish neighbours again after they were arrested by the Gestapo. My mother was very good at running when she was at school but was stopped from engaging in this sport as she did not look Aryan enough! My brother still has the original copy of Mein Kampf she was issued at school - it is written in Gothic Script !

15-11-2015, 16:59	#28
Lazy-Ferret Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Sevenoaks, Kent Vehicle: Terrano 2.7TDi SE Touring Posts: 5,221	The problem is, and the press make this very difficult to differentiate, Religion, social status, nationality and immigration have nothing to do directly with the conversation relating to what happened in Paris. Saying all Muslims are terrorist, because of what is happening currently, is like saying all Catholics are terrorists, because of what happened in northern Ireland, or all Christians are terrorists, because of the crusades/witches/Indians/aborigines/....The same with the whole Israel/Palestine issues at the moment, depending on what side of the fence you were born, or care to look at it, both nationalities are terrorists. The list goes on and on.. Religion as a whole, what ever the faith, is ultimately a brain washing cult, and cults seem to get people doing bad things to others, but it's not just cults, anywhere you can group people under a single name, and then get them all together, bad things can happen. Look at us as a group of Nissan lovers, we are rightly or wrongly, (an usually jokingly) intolerant of LR's, and reading the forum, you would think we would never tolerate a landrover driver to even read our posts, yet there are actually many members who (secretly) either have/do/or aspire to owning one. It seems that as soon as two people have differing opinions, they can't live and let live, they have to convert the other person to their way of thinking, and when these people get into groups, by the laws of averages, you are going to get some people in that group that are hardcore, and take things a bit too far. Since religion is such a personal thing to most people, matters are made far worse as it then involves emotions about what is after all, a hypothetical belief of both people. Guys, please put this topic back into perspective, and don't let the cowards win by causing division every where.... These people are a minority group of cowards, who like the bully at school, seek to further their nefarious cause by causing havoc, and using anything handy to their cause as an excuse to do this. Because of hundreds of years of bad things being done in the call of religion, it is an intrinsically ingrained instinct for humans to react to this, and it always blows out of control, making it perfect for their desires. Ironically, with the internet giving access to unbiased information at the click of a button, this should now be easy to cure, but still people let other people with their own agendas, like the press, and politicians, dictate what they think, instead of reading both sides of the story and making their own mind up. It's those that do read all sides when it comes to religion, that are becoming atheists, as they do not want to be associated with any one religion Please stick to the facts.... A group of cowards called ISIS did this. Stop including the other huge group of Ummah who live their life by a honourable set of rules, just like the majority of jews, druids, wiccans, christians, and buddhists. Remember too, that some of the members of ISIS are were actually, "christian" people who have converted to Muslim so they can go and join them. From my point of view, as someone brought up as a Christian, and who is still surrounded by many, I have made my own personal views about how to live my life, just like most sane, normal, religious people. Sadly, some of the worst people I have ever met, have supposedly, been Christians, and some of the nicest, have been Muslims, and in the same vain, being part of a volunteer 4x4 group, some of the nicest, considerate, helpful people I have met are landrover drivers, one or two are even Muslim landrover drivers.... god forbid!!! The thing is, when we are doing good work, and helping other people, who cares what our beliefs are, so why should we suddenly care when bad things happen?

15-11-2015, 17:27	#29
terranosaurusdoug Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Yorkshire, J33 M62 Vehicle: 2000 Terrano lwb 2.7TDI Posts: 5,500	Hello Mr ferret, can you please refrain from using that term so often, I find it distasteful and offensive, if people want to drive L..d R....s that is their business, but I for one want no part of it! Otherwise well written brother, well written

15-11-2015, 18:14	#30
johnb5177 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Swansea, S.Wales Vehicle: 02Terrano II 3.0 SVE Auto Posts: 1,586	Clive +1, yes well thought out and written......