anti snake

[panelbeater]

i will get the t2 fri and will be towing for 2 weeks.
only thing is at the moment i have a snake bar and my 750kg sprite tows lovely behind my zx.
the t2 has a swan neck ball so i cant fit my snake bar,unless you know different,any advise please.

[cncfabs]

i will get the t2 fri and will be towing for 2 weeks.
only thing is at the moment i have a snake bar and my 750kg sprite tows lovely behind my zx.
the t2 has a swan neck ball so i cant fit my snake bar,unless you know different,any advise please.

What are those snake bars for i do loads of towing never had one i just drive to road conditions:nenau

[Lazy-Ferret]

i will get the t2 fri and will be towing for 2 weeks.
only thing is at the moment i have a snake bar and my 750kg sprite tows lovely behind my zx.
the t2 has a swan neck ball so i cant fit my snake bar,unless you know different,any advise please.
You can get a stabiliser attachment for swan neck bars.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=swan+neck+stabiliser&_nkwusc=sawn+neck+stabalisor&_rdc=1

If you are anywhere near the bridge, I have a second hand one you can buy for £20. We may actually be heading over to Lakeside either Monday or Tuesday, so could meet up. Postage is a killer as it weighs a tonne.

[solarman216]

750 kg sprite on a T2, you can tow that at 100 mph even if poorly loaded, what do you need a "snake bar" for I regularly tow a 4 wheel car trailer with a T2 on it and have hit 90 without any hint of problem, trailer is 450 kg, T2 SWB guess about 1800kg with roll cage two winches and associated iron so all up 2200 plus and tows a treat, Rick

[Lazy-Ferret]

What you guys are forgetting, is for a lot of caravan insurgence companies, you have to use a stabiliser, or you are uninsured if you have an accident.

Having been on the receiving end of having the stabiliser jump off the bracket, and only realising when the caravan tried to over take me on the M5, after being overtaken by an artic, I think that any safety device is worth while for everyone on the road, not just the person towing. The thing is, all vehicles can let you down, I was towing with a Volvo 240, which won tow car of the year for many years, a blow out in a T2, and the sudden change in the set up, might be just enough to send you into a snake.

It's one thing towing something for a few miles, it is another setting off with a van on the back, and trying to relax into your holiday while you are covering several hundred miles, and stand a far greater chance of being distracted or making a mistake at some point in such a long journey.

[solarman216]

Point taken, one thing I do not have that caravans have is the effect of wind, so on that basis alone I guess a stabiliser could be worth while, Rick

[firebobby]

We had a lucky escape once when towing our old ABI caravan, we were going down a hill on a motorway when a van went past quite quickly, this set the van into a snake and I was lucky to be able to get it back from total loss, I was towing with a Volvo 850 TDI and a snake bar.
I have the ALKO stabiliser on my caravan and have never had a problem with it, though if a large vehicle passes to close, you can still feel the van move away from it.

[AD Ent]

We had a lucky escape once when towing our old ABI caravan, we were going down a hill on a motorway when a van went past quite quickly, this set the van into a snake and I was lucky to be able to get it back from total loss, I was towing with a Volvo 850 TDI and a snake bar.
I have the ALKO stabiliser on my caravan and have never had a problem with it, though if a large vehicle passes to close, you can still feel the van move away from it.


I wonder if this would be as much of a problem if towers could travel at 70mph. ? or would it be worse?

[panelbeater]

thanks guys.i cant afford a alko hitch,i normally overtake the lorries,never knew you could get the adaptor but i would need one with the right angle end across the bar not alongside it,looking on the ebay link (thanks for that)it looks like both are available.
looking at them i will be able to alter the one i have got being a dab hand at making things.
lazy,thanks for the offer,at least i know where 1 is if i need 1.
i will see if i can modifie mine other than that a trip to your area with my van for a weekend might be in order.

[Lazy-Ferret]

thanks guys.i cant afford a alko hitch,i
lazy,thanks for the offer,at least i know where 1 is if i need 1.
i will see if i can modifie mine other than that a trip to your area with my van for a weekend might be in order.

No problems, as you say, you know where it is..

My one is one of these..
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SWAN-NECK-NEW-CARAVAN-SNAKEMASTER-STABILISER-ORIGINAL-CAR-PLATE-BRACKET-/330871026134?pt=UK_Campervan_Caravan_Accessories&hash=item4d097331d6

[Lazy-Ferret]

I wonder if this would be as much of a problem if towers could travel at 70mph. ? or would it be worse?

To be honest, it is more the vehicles that are not doing the speed limit that are the problem, at 60, you should not really be overtaken by a lorry anyway, but many break the speed limit. Even if you take it up to 70, you are still going to be overtaken by transits, sprinters etc, and they really do shift some wind at 80mph. I found the worst is when a lorry wings you, they don't really have the power to get past you, especially the speed limited ones, but they do not want to be behind a caravan, so they sit in the middle lane, with the cab on the rear corner of the caravan for ages. That is when you feel the set up become unstable, and it just takes an extra gust to push you over the edge.

At least at 60, most cars still have a bit of back up power in the engine, and as hard as it is to do at the time, the only way to get a bad snake under control, it to pull out of it...

The only bad snake I have ever had, I was at the point of no return, and it was either trying one last ditch attempt to parallel the crash barrier to get it straight, and stop, or listen to the Experts, and stick your foot down..., put the dog back in charge of the tail... When you are travelling at 50mph, and the you already have no control over the car, sticking your foot down, has to be one of the hardest things I have ever done, but sure enough, it pulled back in line, straightened up, and I was able to pull over on to the hard shoulder to recover.

[panelbeater]

i have only ever had one time the twin wheel burger bar i was towing for a concert at framlingham castle started to sway,i was in a twin wheeled transit and that made me slow down,funny thing is i was doing about 55.
i felt it ,saw it and the car that was coming up to overtake it saw it and backed off,put his hazards on to control the flow,which i was grateful for,it came under control but i was very wary about towing some ones bar.
my van is very stable,i thought i had over shot a left turn of off the a12 but hit the ankers and how i got round i dont know as it was not a feeder of but a back on itself left one,that gave me much respect in the zx and sprite.
i puckered my b=m though.

[solarman216]

When I came back from up North with Briggies motor on the trailer and a spare T2 engine in the back of my T2 I wanted to see how well it would do, it was late at night on the M1 and I pushed it to 90 (on the speedo) kept this up for a long time slowing on some gradients then recovering, then at about 75 suddenly started snaking not bad but bad enough, my misses needed new knickers, what we had entered was rutting and the trailer was running up and down these rut as it is 7 ft wide, once I realised what was happening after a few tense moments, pulled into the middle lane while having foot to the floor, job sorted, all I can say is the T2 is a fantastic tow motor, Rick

[Thomas-the-Terrano2]

a stabilizer bar or hitch doesnt make a bad outfit safe.

yet to see a policy that states have to have one, nor are they
a legal requirement. most new caravans come with the hitch
variety, though suggest you want to try without to see how it feels
first.

Ive towed my 1700kg twin axle tin tent behind 2 terranos and a patrol
without any extras, though do have a receiver for a snake master
on the current terrano. your 750kg sprite is going to be less than 50%
of the towcar, indeed it could almost carry the caravan let alone tow it.

[Lazy-Ferret]

a stabilizer bar or hitch doesnt make a bad outfit safe.

yet to see a policy that states have to have one, nor are they
a legal requirement. most new caravans come with the hitch
variety, though suggest you want to try without to see how it feels
first.


Agree.... But it is unlikely to make things any worse.

Our camping and caravanning policy does. We are covered for third party damage on the car insurance, but if we want the fully comp and recovery benefits of the club policy, then we have to have a stabiliser.

I have to say the T2 tows a dream, the only vehicle that I enjoyed towing with as much was my Automatic V70, but I love the height of the T2, and the ease of how you can go up the gears and stay there for all but the more major hills.

[Thomas-the-Terrano2]

no wont make worse, but point is you need to know how outfit handles without and that
its well matched, suspect if policy dictates to that degree likely will say have to keep
under the 85% ratio too, its all adding to peace of mind.

tbf even the current trailer on the t2 is only 85%, back in troll days was down to about
62%!

[(RIP) PLANK]

Agree.... But it is unlikely to make things any worse.

Our camping and caravanning policy does. We are covered for third party damage on the car insurance, but if we want the fully comp and recovery benefits of the club policy, then we have to have a stabiliser.

I have to say the T2 tows a dream, the only vehicle that I enjoyed towing with as much was my Automatic V70, but I love the height of the T2, and the ease of how you can go up the gears and stay there for all but the more major hills.

I have two caravans insured with the camping and caravaning club and neither policy states that i have to use a stabiliser :nenau I tow caravans right up to the maximum 2800k capacity of ahttp://www.nissan4x4ownersclub.com/forum/images/smilies/221208/ne_nau.gif T2 and only use a stabiliser if it's already fitted (i.e. and alko hitch) I have even removed these hitches and found no benefit to them at all :nenau

[Lazy-Ferret]

When we first took our policy out, stating we had a stabiliser, and the tyron bands reduced our premium, IIRC, I think having both saves us 20%.

This is a new version of the policy.
Safe and secure caravanners can save up to 30% on their insurance premium with the new Club Care Reward product.

Available on all makes and models of caravans, including imports, this new insurance product is aimed at higher value caravans of £15,000 or more. With savings typically over £100, Club Care Reward will benefit members who have enhanced the security of their caravan.

To benefit, the member must have either a Club Secure/Phantom Pro-active tracking device fitted and/or a 2006 AL-KO Secure Wheel Lock fitted when not in use. They must have had no more than one claim in the last three years and must use a stabiliser when towing or have Tyron safety bands fitted.

http://www.campingandcaravanningclub.co.uk/news/2007/oct/improved-insurance-for-motorhome-owners-brought-to-you-by-club-care/

[rustic]

We tow our boat and twin axle trailer, weighing over 2 tonnes, and 26 feet long overall, we have never used a stabiliser.
It's all about weight distribution.
For a caravan, which we also towed years ago, without a stabiliser, it is essential to get most of the weight over the axles.
Anything heavy at the back will cause the tail to wag the dog.

Weight should be kept low, and the hitch weight close to the max allowed for the rig and car.

OK what it means is 10 minutes sorting the equipment in the van to the high cupboards and rear lockers, when you get to site, but it really makes for a stable tow.

As said before, staibilisers DO NOT CURE an unstable unit.
What they do is help to reduce the chances of the snaking starting with a stable combination. Some designs of stabiliser can also reduce the pitching of the rear of the vehicle which is uncomfortable for rear seat passengers.


My father one towed a fletcher power boat for a friend, with a Mercury 140 hp outboard on the back with a Short wheel base Series IIa LR,
BOY OH BOY... did this tail wag the dog.... a few hundred kilos of engine so far back was the trigger. The LR was not that heavy to start with.

Which makes me say...
I think LWB vehicles are better tow cars than SWB, due to the longer wheelbase.


Best regards,

Rustic

[s2k_adz]

I pretty regularly tow a car trailer with various different cars on it. I used to use a 4.2 Nissan patrol years ago but have mainly used estate cars due to not having a big 4x4.

Had snaking a few times now, twice pretty violently where I was very lucky to get it back, once in the Patrol going down a hill with a full car and a second engine. We fitted a snake bar and it did help alot, but after playing around with loading lots I feel this is what makes the most difference to snaking. I always tend to load more to the nose now instead of trying to spread the load equally.

[TONUP]

I guess this question is all about your attitude to risk. Our caravan has an Al-Ko stabiliser hitch, and the electronic trailer control device fitted. I am very careful when loading it, and even use a proper noseweight gauge before setting off.

I don't have a lot of experience of towing (four years and maybe 13 trips), but I do think that these safety devices can only serve to improve safety.

I have a very cautious attitude to risk, and never tow above the legal speed limits, and I ensure my caranvan stays below the 85% recommendation.

This wont guarantee that I never have an accident, but I dont agree that it creates complacency through a reliance on technology, which I know some others believe.

Regards

Alan

[solarman216]

Yep load distribution is the key factor, I only have to load my off road car two inches out on the trailer and can feel the difference, never had it snake but can feel the urge is there if it is loaded wrong, and on the odd times I have loaded wrong (for various reasons not just error) I then just keep the speed down, Rick

[panelbeater]

got a good debate going on,all over a snake.

[Lazy-Ferret]

got a good debate going on,all over a snake.

:lol:lol You can only get a good "mass debate" taking place on a forum, just worried that it is only guys joining in...:lol:lol

[melissachels]

I have never used a snake bar as I have nowhere on me horsebox or car to attach it too, Plus its a pony so he moves about, but thankfully no too much. but In my opinion its just common sense stay under 55mph & drive to conditions, mega windy just don't go.

[firebobby]

thanks guys.i cant afford a alko hitch,i normally overtake the lorries,.

Ah, but vans and coaches travel faster than lorries and when you can tow legally up to 60, they will be able to over take you.
I find the worse time is going down hill, this is when I take note of what's coming up behind me...once bitten :augie

Now our expensive add ons (kids) don't come with us any more, we travel fairly light, so not so much clutter and added weight:thumbs

[panelbeater]

yes when coaches etc past me i can feel the rig move but its stable.
i only go past the lorries when they are just under 60 so past then at 65 just to get in front .
some lorries just try to overtake but just have not got the power to and i back of a bit otherwise they hold the flow up.
i was towing a loaded trailer with logs and a left hooker decided to overtake me,it tried for ever and motors were backing up behind us both,so i just pulled away from him to make him pull over to let the traffic through.
he gave me a long blast on his horns.right or wrong i felt he could not get past and as i had a line of traffic behind me i just pulled away.

[rustic]

he gave me a long blast on his horns.right or wrong i felt he could not get past and as i had a line of traffic behind me i just pulled away.
He just made him self look a pratt...:doh
What happens then though, is the frustrated drivers well behind, see an opportunity to get past the lorry and several cars in one go, by undertaking on the inside.:eek:

Undertaking... sounds an appropriate word really.:nenau

Too many people not allowing enough time for their journey is the cause of many accidents.

A pratt driver gets away with it when alone, but put two together on the same road... Crrrrrruuuuuunnnncccchhhhhh.

[Thomas-the-Terrano2]

on subject of swb, my parents once borrowed a swb series 3 landy from fiiends as our
car was in garage for repairs. was dream come true for me in landy but nightmare for
mum and dad, was a 1973 astral ranger caravan 12 foot body back in day was hundred
weight per foot so clearly pretty light even for old style construction. ok no stabilizer
but boy did the van wag that pup. didnt dare go over 40mph and the 2 and a quarter
petrol drank for england, could see fuel gauge moving. Was supposed to be a tour of
scotland but with economy and handling only just got over border to north berwick!

[AD Ent]

could see fuel gauge moving. Was supposed to be a tour of
scotland but with economy and handling only just got over border to north berwick!

:lol:lol:lol

[panelbeater]

well i got back from my first trip out with the t2 and no problems towing.did not have any high cross winds though so i will hold of the bracket for a while and see how it goes.

[solarman216]

He just made him self look a pratt...:doh
What happens then though, is the frustrated drivers well behind, see an opportunity to get past the lorry and several cars in one go, by undertaking on the inside.:eek:

Undertaking... sounds an appropriate word really.:nenau

Too many people not allowing enough time for their journey is the cause of many accidents.

A pratt driver gets away with it when alone, but put two together on the same road... Crrrrrruuuuuunnnncccchhhhhh.

Sound word's there mate, unfortunately it happens too often, Rick

[pepsimaxrock]

I had 2 ponies in my Ifor 510 and my 2003 X trail and it snaked and overturned on the A1 going north down a hill in a medium to high wind.
Everyone was fine inc ponies and car.
Trailer was a write off
I use stabilisers now.
But this should not have happened. I dont want criticism of the trailer, or the car, everything was legal. Perhaps better combinations could have been made, but I dont need those suggestions I just wonder how it happened?

[darryl]

well im no expert but when towing a caravan on the motorway when I see a lorry or anything big I just take the car over the rumble strip to the left never had a problem:thumb2